Demonetization, a failure

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Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sat Jul 01, 2017 10:43 pm

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/29/opinion/india-and-the-visible-hand-of-the-market.html

http://www.livemint.com/Money/g6iNGKdOfxxXCPKxgsFsSP/Electronic-money-transactions-are-back-to-predemonetization.html

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Wed Jul 05, 2017 6:18 pm

MUMBAI (NewsRise) -- The launch of new residential projects in India slumped the most in seven years in the first half of 2017, as a high-value currency ban and a slew of regulatory changes for the real estate sector damped demand, according to a Knight Frank survey.

The industry saw 41% fewer new residential project launches in the first half as sales fell 11% on-year to the lowest five years, the real estate consultant said in a report on Wednesday, based on a survey across eight Indian cities.

In November, Prime Minister Narendra Modi's government recalled high-value currency bills of 500 rupees and 1,000 rupees in a bid to flush out unaccounted wealth. The move resulted in a cash shortage in Asia's third-largest economy, crimping consumer spending. The real estate sector was particularly hit as a bulk of the financial transactions is via cash.

After the so-called demonetization, real estate companies such as DLF and Prestige reported a slump in sales.
http://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/Economy/India-cash-crunch-rules-trigger-worst-slump-in-7-years-for-new-residential-projects?page=1

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:35 am

Yes, it was a bold and workable idea but sub standard planning and execution by Govt and Banks made it a failure. Other than getting the money once into banks and thus leaving some hints/notes for the taxman it accomplished nothing more. Too expensive for what it finally accomplished. Could have done lot more if only it was planned and executed well. Opposition both barked too early and surrendered meekly to the Govt narratives.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:20 am

smArtha wrote:Yes, it was a bold and workable idea but sub standard planning and execution by Govt and Banks made it a failure. Other than getting the money once into banks and thus leaving some hints/notes for the taxman it accomplished nothing more. Too expensive for what it finally accomplished. Could have done lot more if only it was planned and executed well. Opposition both barked too early and surrendered meekly to the Govt narratives.
Just not the execution, the concept itself is half-baked.
India’s economy is struggling to recover its strong growth record, beset by record low inflation, a widening output gap, and short term uncertainty from the introduction of a uniform sales tax.

That will build pressure on the Reserve Bank of India to jettison its neutral monetary policy bias adopted just five months ago, setting the scene for lowering interest rates perhaps as early as next month, besides reminding yield-chasing investors that putting money in India is not without risks.

Any reduction in interest rates will be in contrast to what major central banks are trying to signal -- a rise in borrowing costs-- and could trip the Indian rupee which hit a 20-month high in April. This would be bad news for a country that needs to attract billions of dollars in foreign investments to make up a shortfall in domestic capital.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-03/slowing-inflation-puts-dampener-on-india-s-robust-growth-record

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:01 pm

But these goals were never met. 97% of the demonetized notes were turned in, meaning that very little black money was caught stranded and the central bank’s estimated $45 billion bonus never transpired. India’s black market — as dynamic and active as it is — rarely stores money in cash long-term, as its players prefer other ways of storing wealth, such as jewelry or property, and what cash they were stuck with was mostly exchanged through clever tactics or brute force.

In terms of dealing counterfeiters a terminal blow, demonetization was successful at wiping out all of the fake notes that were in circulation at the onset of the initiative, but counterfeits of the new 2,000 rupee notes began emerging almost as soon as the legitimate ones were minted.

Demonetization’s goals of curbing the black economy and wiping out counterfeits -- two intentions that galvanized the population and bolstered wide support for the initiative -- appear to have been complete flops.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/wadeshepard/2017/07/29/how-india-is-surviving-post-demonetization/#5d2458421164

Cashless economy was a clever twist or a by-product, not one of the original goals of demonetization.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Idéfix on Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:56 pm

smArtha wrote:Yes, it was a bold and workable idea but sub standard planning and execution by Govt and Banks made it a failure. Other than getting the money once into banks and thus leaving some hints/notes for the taxman it accomplished nothing more. Too expensive for what it finally accomplished. Could have done lot more if only it was planned and executed well. Opposition both barked too early and surrendered meekly to the Govt narratives.
Yeah, it was done rather poorly. I was in India for a few days before the exchange period for old notes ended. I hope they use the "hints" they collected, but lots of rich people got around it by having their agents turn in their cash. For the first few weeks, the government was talking about the percent of total old money returned and saying if 80% is turned in, that means 20% was black money that is now invalidated. The last time they talked about the number it was already north of 90% and rumor is that more than 100% of the expected value was turned in and exchanged for new bills. So the original stated purpose of combating black money was not served at all.

So supporters of the government came up with ridiculous fake news. Like the idea that the new bills have chips in them that talk to satellites and tell them the exact location of the bills! And the government started moving the goalposts, talking about the middle-class dream of leapfrogging America and becoming a cashless society.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by ashdoc on Sun Jul 30, 2017 11:01 pm

The main goal was to make a move against corruption that would be visible even to the illiterate person. Something that would increase the popularity of the government and above all the prime minister.  In that sense it succeeded spectacularly.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:19 pm

Idéfix wrote:
smArtha wrote:Yes, it was a bold and workable idea but sub standard planning and execution by Govt and Banks made it a failure. Other than getting the money once into banks and thus leaving some hints/notes for the taxman it accomplished nothing more. Too expensive for what it finally accomplished. Could have done lot more if only it was planned and executed well. Opposition both barked too early and surrendered meekly to the Govt narratives.
Yeah, it was done rather poorly. I was in India for a few days before the exchange period for old notes ended. I hope they use the "hints" they collected, but lots of rich people got around it by having their agents turn in their cash. For the first few weeks, the government was talking about the percent of total old money returned and saying if 80% is turned in, that means 20% was black money that is now invalidated. The last time they talked about the number it was already north of 90% and rumor is that more than 100% of the expected value was turned in and exchanged for new bills. So the original stated purpose of combating black money was not served at all.

So supporters of the government came up with ridiculous fake news. Like the idea that the new bills have chips in them that talk to satellites and tell them the exact location of the bills! And the government started moving the goalposts, talking about the middle-class dream of leapfrogging America and becoming a cashless society.


I was in India too the week after the Demonetization hit. Roads were all empty and the punjagutta x roads that generally takes 15-20 min to cross during the commute times was at about 20% usual traffic. Fortunately, in the first week there were not much restrictions on max cash to be withdrawn and so between 2 accounts I withdrew 1 lac with and 20k in 100s and that kept me going the whole 2+ weeks of my stay. 

My take is that RBI should have printed and got into circulation Rs. 250 and then Rs. 5K notes almost an year before the demonetization and also increased the circulation of Rs. 100 (printing more and dispersing 100s for under 10k withdrawals). They should have then let out news that Rs. 500 will be demonetized in a few (3-6) months.. thus allowing the hoarders to move towards 1k and 5k notes while the common man converted them to 250 denominations. And then come the D-day announce demonetization of 500, 1k and 5k all at one go in a much tighter window (2-3 weeks). This would have got more black money out of the system without cash availability issues for the middle and lower classes.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:58 pm

smArtha wrote:
Idéfix wrote:
smArtha wrote:Yes, it was a bold and workable idea but sub standard planning and execution by Govt and Banks made it a failure. Other than getting the money once into banks and thus leaving some hints/notes for the taxman it accomplished nothing more. Too expensive for what it finally accomplished. Could have done lot more if only it was planned and executed well. Opposition both barked too early and surrendered meekly to the Govt narratives.
Yeah, it was done rather poorly. I was in India for a few days before the exchange period for old notes ended. I hope they use the "hints" they collected, but lots of rich people got around it by having their agents turn in their cash. For the first few weeks, the government was talking about the percent of total old money returned and saying if 80% is turned in, that means 20% was black money that is now invalidated. The last time they talked about the number it was already north of 90% and rumor is that more than 100% of the expected value was turned in and exchanged for new bills. So the original stated purpose of combating black money was not served at all.

So supporters of the government came up with ridiculous fake news. Like the idea that the new bills have chips in them that talk to satellites and tell them the exact location of the bills! And the government started moving the goalposts, talking about the middle-class dream of leapfrogging America and becoming a cashless society.


I was in India too the week after the Demonetization hit. Roads were all empty and the punjagutta x roads that generally takes 15-20 min to cross during the commute times was at about 20% usual traffic. Fortunately, in the first week there were not much restrictions on max cash to be withdrawn and so between 2 accounts I withdrew 1 lac with and 20k in 100s and that kept me going the whole 2+ weeks of my stay. 

My take is that RBI should have printed and got into circulation Rs. 250 and then Rs. 5K notes almost an year before the demonetization and also increased the circulation of Rs. 100 (printing more and dispersing 100s for under 10k withdrawals). They should have then let out news that Rs. 500 will be demonetized in a few (3-6) months.. thus allowing the hoarders to move towards 1k and 5k notes while the common man converted them to 250 denominations. And then come the D-day announce demonetization of 500, 1k and 5k all at one go in a much tighter window (2-3 weeks). This would have got more black money out of the system without cash availability issues for the middle and lower classes.
Whichever way you want to skin a cat, it was a just plain dumb idea. The reason they didn't print new denominations ahead of time because they're worried about leaks of their intentions.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:59 pm

ashdoc wrote:The main goal was to make a move against corruption that would be visible even to the illiterate person. Something that would increase the popularity of the government and above all the prime minister.  In that sense it succeeded spectacularly.
Couldn't agree more. There're lots of folks that still believe that it was mega success.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:19 pm


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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by silvermani on Sun Aug 13, 2017 12:51 am

Jobless growth - it was a term I heard first during Bush's time. In Obummer's time, there was tremendous growth - in the wealth of rich Americans, the number of food stamp recipients and in low wage burger flipper/waiter jobs.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:58 am

silvermani wrote:Jobless growth - it was a term I heard first during Bush's time. In Obummer's time, there was tremendous growth - in the wealth of rich Americans, the number of food stamp recipients and in low wage burger flipper/waiter jobs.
It is getting much better now, they're getting paid highly for running over people with their sport cars. In other words, the days of low paying jobs are over.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by silvermani on Sun Aug 13, 2017 11:25 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
silvermani wrote:Jobless growth - it was a term I heard first during Bush's time. In Obummer's time, there was tremendous growth - in the wealth of rich Americans, the number of food stamp recipients and in low wage burger flipper/waiter jobs.
It is getting much better now, they're getting paid highly for running over people with their sport cars. In other words, the days of low paying jobs are over.
There were highly paid "protestor" jobs during Obummer's time also. George Soros was funding such activities.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Aug 13, 2017 12:02 pm

silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
silvermani wrote:Jobless growth - it was a term I heard first during Bush's time. In Obummer's time, there was tremendous growth - in the wealth of rich Americans, the number of food stamp recipients and in low wage burger flipper/waiter jobs.
It is getting much better now, they're getting paid highly for running over people with their sport cars. In other words, the days of low paying jobs are over.
There were highly paid "protestor" jobs during Obummer's time also. George Soros was funding such activities.
You can't have it both ways. Obama was responsible for either low paying jobs or highly paid protestor jobs. Take your pick

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by silvermani on Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:02 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
silvermani wrote:Jobless growth - it was a term I heard first during Bush's time. In Obummer's time, there was tremendous growth - in the wealth of rich Americans, the number of food stamp recipients and in low wage burger flipper/waiter jobs.
It is getting much better now, they're getting paid highly for running over people with their sport cars. In other words, the days of low paying jobs are over.
There were highly paid "protestor" jobs during Obummer's time also. George Soros was funding such activities.
You can't have it both ways. Obama was responsible for either low paying jobs or highly paid protestor jobs. Take your pick
When all you have is low paid jobs, you get tempted to take up paid protester jobs.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:02 pm

So, the Survey said the tax base did expand after demonetisation. “It is, however, interesting that the average income reported of the new taxpayers — Rs 2.7 lakh — was not far above the tax threshold of Rs 2.5 lakh, so the immediate impact on tax collections was muted,” said the Economic Survey volume 2 tabled in the Parliament on Friday.
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/business/in-other-news/140817/no-big-fish-among-new-taxpayers-says-cea.html

India's low income tax revenue issue is blown way out of proportion by media and the govt. According to them less than 3% of workforce (or about 3.5 crore) files income tax returns. I see this as a reflection of India's economic condition & governing policies than tax evasion tendency of average Indian, which imo is no more than a cash based small business owner in the US. Per the statistics released by NSSO in 2014, India's workforce is about 47 crores, of which 34 crores are rural workers. 23 crores of rural workforce are agricultural labor or have farming income who are tax exempt. So, that leaves us with 11 crore rural non-agriculture workers + 13 crore urban workers, all in all, 24 crores taxable workforce, if you go by Indian middle class & below poverty line stats, about 3/4th of them won't have the 2.5 lakh income to file taxes which means about 6 crores should file tax returns. So about 2.5 crores out of 6 crores are not filing their tax returns but I doubt any of them are crorepathis so the additional revenues from income tax will be minimal. I see this as a moral issue than the monetary issue this govt makes it to be.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:30 pm

Here is an interesting article that exposed double-tongued Modi

It is thus premature to conclude automatically that India’s inordinately low tax base is entirely a function of massive tax evasion by Indians. While lowering the income tax rates, had the Finance Minister also lowered the income tax exemption threshold to say Rs 1.5 lakh, 1.1 crore more Indians would have automatically qualified to pay income tax. This would have brought India more in-line with the rest of the world in terms of exemption threshold to per capita GDP ratio
https://www.bloombergquint.com/opinion/2017/02/20/decoding-indias-low-tax-base-conundrum

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:34 pm

"Indeed, unemployment is the lesser of India's problems. The more serious problem, instead, is severe underemployment," the Aayog said in the Three-Year Action Agenda for 2017-18 to 2019-20.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/economy/policy/india-facing-problem-of-severe-under-employment-says-niti/articleshow/60243759.cms

Duh! govt. finally woke up  from its Kumbhakarana's imitation. Still trying hard to hide the facts.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:28 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
"Indeed, unemployment is the lesser of India's problems. The more serious problem, instead, is severe underemployment," the Aayog said in the Three-Year Action Agenda for 2017-18 to 2019-20.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/economy/policy/india-facing-problem-of-severe-under-employment-says-niti/articleshow/60243759.cms

Duh! govt. finally woke up  from its Kumbhakarana's imitation. Still trying hard to hide the facts.

How is this relevant to Demonetization? The article clearly states that for over 3 decades (guess who was ruling for most of that period) it is not unemployment but underemployment the issue. How can you then say that this Govt is trying to hide those facts? Why would they hide the inefficiency of the prior regimes? Don't disappoint your almost non-existent supporters here with such lack of 'common-sense' reasoning.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:35 pm

smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
"Indeed, unemployment is the lesser of India's problems. The more serious problem, instead, is severe underemployment," the Aayog said in the Three-Year Action Agenda for 2017-18 to 2019-20.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/economy/policy/india-facing-problem-of-severe-under-employment-says-niti/articleshow/60243759.cms

Duh! govt. finally woke up  from its Kumbhakarana's imitation. Still trying hard to hide the facts.

How is this relevant to Demonetization? The article clearly states that for over 3 decades (guess who was ruling for most of that period) it is not unemployment but underemployment the issue. How can you then say that this Govt is trying to hide those facts? Why would they hide the inefficiency of the prior regimes? Don't disappoint your almost non-existent supporters here with such lack of 'common-sense' reasoning.
Aha! Then why was Modi accusing previous govt. of jobless growth and promised creating crores of jobs? Govt. is hiding the facts because their accomplishment on jobs front is a net loss and is relevant to demonetization because 14 lakh jobs were lost in informal sector as a result of demonetization. Do your home work before assuming stuff about others reasoning.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Mon Aug 28, 2017 8:39 pm

Nearly 10 months after India’s unprecedented ban on high value notes that was designed to tackle entrenched corruption, bribery continues to oil the wheels of business in Asia’s third-largest economy, according to a U.S. risk management firm that advises foreign investors.

Gifting of land, houses, luxury watches and sponsoring expensive travel abroad are now the preferred bribes as tax authorities clamp down on high value cash transactions. And for India’s vast shadow economy, estimated by McKinsey & Co. at a fourth of the $2 trillion economy, the cash ban has hardly made a dent.
http://fortune.com/2017/08/28/india-cash-ban-corruption-bribery/

What a colossal failure and waste of resources;  major accomplishment of this move was causing hardship to common man.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Tue Aug 29, 2017 9:32 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
"Indeed, unemployment is the lesser of India's problems. The more serious problem, instead, is severe underemployment," the Aayog said in the Three-Year Action Agenda for 2017-18 to 2019-20.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/economy/policy/india-facing-problem-of-severe-under-employment-says-niti/articleshow/60243759.cms

Duh! govt. finally woke up  from its Kumbhakarana's imitation. Still trying hard to hide the facts.

How is this relevant to Demonetization? The article clearly states that for over 3 decades (guess who was ruling for most of that period) it is not unemployment but underemployment the issue. How can you then say that this Govt is trying to hide those facts? Why would they hide the inefficiency of the prior regimes? Don't disappoint your almost non-existent supporters here with such lack of 'common-sense' reasoning.
Aha! Then why was Modi accusing previous govt. of jobless growth and promised creating crores of jobs? Govt. is hiding the facts because their accomplishment on jobs front is a net loss and is relevant to demonetization because 14 lakh jobs were lost in informal sector as a result of demonetization. Do your home work before assuming stuff about others reasoning.

This jumping goals proves your weak logic and arguments. The article you posted is about underemployment and NOT unemployment. Also, it talks about about 3+ decades of prevelance of such malaise.No where it mentions Demonetization. Yet you find your 'creativity' of linking 3 decades of underemployment with unemployment due to demonetization very logically sound.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:47 pm

smArtha wrote:
This jumping goals proves your weak logic and arguments. The article you posted is about underemployment and NOT unemployment. Also, it talks about about 3+ decades of prevelance of such malaise.No where it mentions Demonetization. Yet you find your 'creativity' of linking 3 decades of underemployment with unemployment due to demonetization very logically sound.
What exactly is moving goal post per you? My comment was about the report that conveniently excluded the jobs lost/affected directly by demonetization and twisting it to cover up the fake promises of fakester (about creating tons of jobs).

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Thu Aug 31, 2017 5:41 am

Almost none of the currency banned in the move was flushed out of the banks, central bank data showed on Wednesday.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-41106439

rofl feku proved yet again that he is a feku after all; very good at duping his bhakt-jan.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Thu Aug 31, 2017 5:50 am

Has demonetisation been a success or a failure? As per the RBI data, it's safe to say that demonetisation has been a failure of epic proportions.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-41100610

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Seva Lamberdar on Thu Aug 31, 2017 9:19 am

any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Thu Aug 31, 2017 10:17 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
Has demonetisation been a success or a failure? As per the RBI data, it's safe to say that demonetisation has been a failure of epic proportions.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-41100610

As I said before it is an idea that needed very detailed and meticulous planning, well preparedness and quick and efficient execution. Modi took the decision to implement it in a very haphazard fashion. So all the money came back through some or other channels. For eg: Sources tell me that Jagan was very worried the first week or two as he apparently had about 300cr worth in cash. But by week-3 everyone figured out how to use the system (and its loopholes) to get them deposited in one or other account. Modi solely owns this failure (as he'd if it was successful) and the buck stops with him. The blessing for the ruling regime is it didn't hurt them politically - not yet.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:44 am

Seva Lamberdar wrote:any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by silvermani on Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:31 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.
Very true - in the case of the hope peddling con man Obummer.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:21 am

confuzzled dude wrote:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-05/modi-s-10-million-jobs-challenge-may-be-biggest-re-election-risk

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Seva Lamberdar on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:12 pm

silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.
Very true - in the case of the hope peddling con man Obummer.
Moreover, as Plato had said, "Never discourage anyone who continually makes progress, no matter how slow."
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:23 pm

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.
Very true - in the case of the hope peddling con man Obummer.
Moreover, as Plato had said, "Never discourage anyone who continually makes progress, no matter how slow."
I'm afraid propping up religious nutcasism isn't making progress let alone continually making progress.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Seva Lamberdar on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:33 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:
silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:any effort to change and upgrade an old and inefficient system, even if that effort does not bring desired results, should not be looked at as a complete loss or waste
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.
Very true - in the case of the hope peddling con man Obummer.
Moreover, as Plato had said, "Never discourage anyone who continually makes progress, no matter how slow."
I'm afraid propping up religious nutcasism isn't making progress let alone continually making progress.
What part of demonetization in the form of withdrawing 500 rupee and 1000 rupee notes to curtail black money and face currency is religious nutcasism?
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:39 pm

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Seva Lamberdar wrote:
silvermani wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Educated elite, keep praising the con-man/feku despite being duped by him, time and again; There isn't much difference in the mindset of GurmeetRamRaheem's followers and the ardent supporters of GurmeetRamModi. Both are typical cult followers.
Very true - in the case of the hope peddling con man Obummer.
Moreover, as Plato had said, "Never discourage anyone who continually makes progress, no matter how slow."
I'm afraid propping up religious nutcasism isn't making progress let alone continually making progress.
What part of demonetization in the form of withdrawing 500 rupee and 1000 rupee notes to curtail black money and face currency is religious nutcasism?
What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:51 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Propagandhi711 on Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:32 pm

smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

comrade is a known practitioner of some such approaches. he often gets his logic so hopelessly twisted that when ppl lose interest in arguing with him, he thinks he's won on merit. another well known practitioner is the psychically and mentally challenged perennial phd student

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Vakavaka Pakapaka on Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:36 pm

Propagandhi711 wrote:
smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

comrade is a known practitioner of some such approaches. he often gets his logic so hopelessly twisted that when ppl lose interest in arguing with him, he thinks he's won on merit. another well known practitioner is the psychically and mentally challenged perennial phd student
He is no longer a student. They gave him a master's degree.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by smArtha on Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:00 pm

Propagandhi711 wrote:
smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

comrade is a known practitioner of some such approaches. he often gets his logic so hopelessly twisted that when ppl lose interest in arguing with him, he thinks he's won on merit. another well known practitioner is the psychically and mentally challenged perennial phd student

True and CD's routine seems to be - wake up.. google web for negative news about/in India. Then pick a totally unrelated anti Modi op-ed and argue that the negative is because of Modi and the op-ed is 'proof' of that.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:59 pm

smArtha wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:
smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

comrade is a known practitioner of some such approaches. he often gets his logic so hopelessly twisted that when ppl lose interest in arguing with him, he thinks he's won on merit. another well known practitioner is the psychically and mentally challenged perennial phd student

True and CD's routine seems to be - wake up.. google web for negative news about/in India. Then pick a totally unrelated anti Modi op-ed and argue that the negative is because of Modi and the op-ed is 'proof' of that.
You guys are nitpicking because you can't make a substantiated argument about Modi's agenda nor can defend his policies, as most of them have been utter failures. As for posting unrelated stuff in a thread, that is the hallmark of SuCH, often threads morph into something altogether different from the OP; it is a free forum unlike some other forums that are micromanaged to death. I, on the other hand, post related stuff in a thread so I don't spam this board with umpteen threads.

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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by Seva Lamberdar on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:02 pm

Vakavaka Pakapaka wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:
smArtha wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:

What Modi did with demonetization move was dictatorial which I presume is not a progressive's trait. My reference to religious nutcasism is about his overall modus operandi not specific to demonetization.

This is what is called mOkAlu - bOdi gundu linking approach

comrade is a known practitioner of some such approaches. he often gets his logic so hopelessly twisted that when ppl lose interest in arguing with him, he thinks he's won on merit. another well known practitioner is the psychically and mentally challenged perennial phd student
He is no longer a student. They gave him a master's degree.
may be he should show his Ph.D. diploma.
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Re: Demonetization, a failure

Post by confuzzled dude on Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:49 am

Want crop loan? Line up outside banks. Loan waiver: Queue up to fill and submit an application. Want to build a toilet; need subsidy? There’s a queue. Stand up India has assumed a whole new dimension here. There is no guarantee though that standing in a queue might fetch what you so desperately covet.

It began with demonetisation last November when rural India lined up to exchange old notes for new ones like the urban India did, but the pain lasted several months. Even today, cash isn’t easy to come by in many rural branches; hundreds of ATMs have fallen silent in the countryside, and digitisation is now a synonym for queuing up. In fact until November 8, 2016, standing up in a queue was not a means of life as it has today become in a changed India. Sure, among the many intended objectives of the note-ban the Union Finance Minister Arun Jaitley told us we do not get it, making a farmer stand up in a queue may not have been intentional. It came as a by-product; small things happen in a big country. The FM wants us to stay focused on the big picture, even if the reality is scarier than the myth around it.

The clamour on the ground is getting shriller, even if the noise is inaudible in Delhi.
The Central Statistics Office’s (CSO) just-released GDP data for April-June 2017 shows that the annual growth in gross value added from agriculture during the last quarter, particularly in June when India saw a sharp rise in farmers’ protests, was only 2.3 per cent in real terms (i.e. at constant prices), as against 5.2 per cent for January-March and 6.9 per cent for October-December, Harish Damodaran of the Indian Express wrote on September 2, 2017. “But what’s more significant,” he wrote, “is the growth in nominal terms or at current prices unadjusted for inflation. That, at 0.3 per cent, was even lower. Simply put, it means that even though farm output for the last quarter was 2.3 per cent higher year-on-year, the fall in prices by 2 per cent resulted in the value of agricultural production rising just 0.3 per cent.”

The CSO does not say it but post demonetisation, not only did the prices across the farm commodities crash, procurement became a gigantic task, both for the state governments and private traders.

A large quantity of ‘Tur’ (Red Gram) is still lying unsold with many farmers across central India since the state governments grappled with bumper harvests of the crop last season.

The CSO data confirms that agriculture entered deflation territory in April, coinciding with the harvesting and marketing of rabi crops, Damodaran wrote, and its effects truly played out in June.
http://www.news18.com/news/india/what-did-demonetisation-do-to-indias-beleaguered-rural-economy-1514251.html

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