ideology

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:09 am

you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?

by Guest Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:12 am

in the Paris attack the attackers were reportedly using kalashnikovs and grenades. The question is: since these guys obviously lack the ability to manufacture these weapons on their own, how did they get access to them?

by swapna Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:54 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?

why do some countries go to war against many parts of the world that are not hostile towards them?

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:04 am

swapna wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
why do some countries go to war against many parts of the world that are not hostile towards them?

good question, but no easy answers. what moral responsibility does the world have towards a people who are being raped and pillaged in their own lands simply because they adhere to a different faith?

by southindian Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:25 am

First: I'm eagerly looking to find out number of awards that are going to be returned after intolerence of Muslims in Paris.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:28 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
swapna wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
why do some countries go to war against many parts of the world that are not hostile towards them?

good question, but no easy answers. what moral responsibility does the world have towards a people who are being raped and pillaged in their own lands simply because they adhere to a different faith?

This is a sociological question. Either one can assume that we all live in one inter-connected and inter-dependent world, expecting everyone to live within a common set of minimum laws. But, that is not likely to happen when one set of people assume that they would not follow any guidelines other than their own.

The second option is to stayaway and keep quiet and focus on protecting your own family, tribe, people - ignoring everything else happening around your neighborhood. All the troubles start only when people want to have the cake and eat it too.

by southindian Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:34 am

Second: They migrate, ask for rights, ghetto, demand separate identity...

...become a unit, ... then slaughter.

The trend is same everywhere.

Visit UK, France and try walking in a Muslim neigborhood. See how they police against women wearing skirts and couples walking together.

They ALWAYS impose their rules in EVERY society.

Thomas, Son the world cannot move forward with one wheel in 7th century and other in 21st. You cannot defend their way of living while accusing Hindus of following another way of life. Dude, did you figure out you are a hypocrite!

These bastards need to be stopped if society wants to go to 22nd century.

by Vakavaka Pakapaka Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:40 am

This is a highly intellectual discussion between Max, FF and Rashmun. So, I can't participate.

Looking forward to extremely smart conclusions that will eradicate all problems of the world. In the past, only a handful of highly rational thinkers were able to analyze and solve such intractable issues - Pol Pot, Mao, Periyar..........

by garam_kuta Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:45 am

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
swapna wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
why do some countries go to war against many parts of the world that are not hostile towards them?

good question, but no easy answers. what moral responsibility does the world have towards a people who are being raped and pillaged in their own lands simply because they adhere to a different faith?

This is a sociological question. Either one can assume that we all live in one inter-connected and inter-dependent world, expecting everyone to live within a common set of minimum laws. But, that is not likely to happen when one set of people assume that they would not follow any guidelines other than their own.

The second option is to stayaway and keep quiet and focus on protecting your own family, tribe, people - ignoring everything else happening around your neighborhood. All the troubles start only when people want to have the cake and eat it too.

in one word: greed, i.e., the problem of the homo sapiens throughout the known history; unless greed is rejected, neither 'live and let live' nor 'not in my backyard' is likely to work long term.

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:46 am

Vakavaka Pakapaka wrote:This is highly intellectual discussion between Max, FF and Rashmun. So, I can't participate.

Looking forward to extremely smart conclusions that will eradicate all problems of the world. In the psst, only a handful of highly rational thinkers were able to analyze and solve such intractable issues - Pol Pot, Mao, Periyar..........

then why did you change your mind?

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:52 am

southindian wrote:First: I'm eagerly looking to find out number of awards that are going to be returned after intolerence of Muslims in Paris.

intolerance of muslims? are you crazy ? it is the intolerance of the French Police who interfered with the muslims were just (s)praying.

Merlot, Rashmun, CD, ans Swapna have not said a word against the attack. Shows muslims did not do anything wrong.

Some awards may be returned for excessive intolerant action by the police. In fact Indian ex-awardees have asked that their awards be returned to them so that they can return them again protest.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:57 am

garam_kuta wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
swapna wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
why do some countries go to war against many parts of the world that are not hostile towards them?

good question, but no easy answers. what moral responsibility does the world have towards a people who are being raped and pillaged in their own lands simply because they adhere to a different faith?

This is a sociological question. Either one can assume that we all live in one inter-connected and inter-dependent world, expecting everyone to live within a common set of minimum laws. But, that is not likely to happen when one set of people assume that they would not follow any guidelines other than their own.

The second option is to stayaway and keep quiet and focus on protecting your own family, tribe, people - ignoring everything else happening around your neighborhood. All the troubles start only when people want to have the cake and eat it too.

in one word: greed, i.e., the problem of the homo sapiens throughout the known history; unless greed is rejected, neither 'live and let live' nor 'not in my backyard' is likely to work long term.

(a)greed. Greed of power, wealth, and women (as women are considered a man's possession openly and indirectly the world over.

by southindian Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:03 am

Let me answer for them about the tragedy.

It was a tragedy that 8 Muslims carrying protective AK47s were killed by French police.

Could someone ask Arundhati Roy and others to return their awards for above tragedy.

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:05 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?

Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:31 am

.....ISIL and muslim fams laud Paris attack

And, we are wondering why there has been no comment or condemnation from Merlot, Rashmun, CD, and Swapna - they must be "celebrating" and perhaps, praying that the dead somehow include hindus.

by Vakavaka Pakapaka Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:34 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
Vakavaka Pakapaka wrote:This is highly intellectual discussion between Max, FF and Rashmun. So, I can't participate.

Looking forward to extremely smart conclusions that will eradicate all problems of the world. In the psst, only a handful of highly rational thinkers were able to analyze and solve such intractable issues - Pol Pot, Mao, Periyar..........

then why did you change your mind?

I didn't. I was just stating the obvious :-).

by southindian Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:35 am

Wow... what a twist from CD.

Max, CDs idiocy is all for you to handle. Good Luck.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:43 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

What is it that attracts you to ISIL, Jehadis, and the iSlamic intolerance ?

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:57 am

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

What is it that attracts you to ISIL, Jehadis, and the iSlamic intolerance ?

Let's count the # of times that I posted the above words vs you. I bet you did > 100 times than I did, and that makes who attracted to ISIL, Jehadis?

by Vakavaka Pakapaka Sat Nov 14, 2015 12:12 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

What is it that attracts you to ISIL, Jehadis, and the iSlamic intolerance ?
Let's count the # of times that I posted the above words vs you. I bet you did > 100 times than I did, and that makes who attracted to ISIL, Jehadis?

Fatal attraction sometimes leads to silence!

How many Pakis criticize Osama, ISIS, Laqvi, Saeed, Dawood....???

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 12:16 pm

maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.

by Guest Sat Nov 14, 2015 12:18 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:

.....ISIL and muslim fams laud Paris attack

And, we are wondering why there has been no comment or condemnation from Merlot, Rashmun, CD, and Swapna - they must be "celebrating" and perhaps, praying that the dead somehow include hindus.

so if we do not condemn the Paris attack on the such forum we automatically must be celebrating them and praying perhaps that the victims include Hindus? Great Logic, Marathadi. By the way, when are you going to stop pooping? You fart and poop all over the place and make everything around you dirty, filthy, messy, and stinky. I think you need this:

https://www.agingcare.com/Articles/how-to-convince-elderly-parent-to-wear-adult-diapers-145643.htm

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:00 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.

Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:16 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship

Why are you trying SOMEHOW to support and justify iSlamic terrorists - ISIL, LeT, or any iSlamic outfit - whenever they indulge in a terror act ?

by goodcitizn Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:42 pm

I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:46 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship

Why are you trying SOMEHOW to support and justify iSlamic terrorists - ISIL, LeT, or any iSlamic outfit - whenever they indulge in a terror act ?

I'm neither supporting them nor justifying their acts, was merely discussing the probable root cause, as that seems to be the talking point of this thread.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:49 pm

goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:51 pm

1 French born and 2 Belgian residents arrested.

Stay tuned.

by goodcitizn Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:58 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.

Upps, I was not talking about independent groups of muslims voicing their disapproval of such acts; my comment was about muslim countries. So far I have heard only the President of Afghanistan denounce such attacks.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:04 pm

goodcitizn wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.

Upps, I was not talking about independent groups of muslims voicing their disapproval of such acts; my comment was about muslim countries. So far I have heard only the President of Afghanistan denounce such attacks.

...Here....Terrorism knows no religion

...but only iSlam - the great religion - invented, developed, and mastered terrorism.

by Kris Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:04 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship

>>>Here is the problem with that theory. Governmental sponsors can change their minds or can be persuaded due to economic or political considerations. When you think your marching orders are from God and death is a doorway to a physical paradise , you have a whole different ballgame. And if the cause is based some idiotic world-view based on a literal interpretation of religion and you have no capacity to question it or are not allowed to, you are screwed. That by itself may not be a problem for others. It is when you start killing others for this cause, it becomes their problem as well.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:09 pm

Kris wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship
>>>Here is the problem with that theory. Governmental sponsors can change their minds or can be persuaded due to economic or political considerations. When you think your marching orders are from God and death is a doorway to a physical paradise , you have a whole different ballgame. And if the cause is based some idiotic world-view based on a literal interpretation of religion and you have no capacity to question it or are not allowed to, you are screwed. That by itself may not be a problem for others. It is when you start killing others for this cause, it becomes their problem as well.

You too, Chaddi ?

Did you recite your koran today ?

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:18 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.

Oh! shut up with your incoherent blather and illogical rhetoric. Islam is one half of the equation and nobody wants to highlight the other half i.e. enablers of this ideology (funding, training). Middle east's struggles were, as I understand, tribal/social issues/in-fights between Sunnis vs Shias vs Kurds and other varieties of Islam, not very different from the situation that existed between Tamilians and Sinhalese but for some reason, incomprehensible to me, we want to separate them and view them as different ideologies. Let's think through this scenario, What would have happened had India secretly intervened and armed, trained LTTE when SL army was massacring Tamilians (for right or wrong) on the orders of Rajpaksa, would he have been successful in eliminating LTTE? Better yet, Pakistan, China jump into the fray in support of Sri Lanka and some other country comes to support India and LTTE. What would that have resulted into?

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:22 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.
Oh! shut up with your incoherent blather and illogical rhetoric. Islam is one half of the equation and nobody wants to highlight the other half i.e. enablers of this ideology (funding, training). Middle east's struggles were, as I understand, tribal/social issues/in-fights between Sunnis vs Shias vs Kurds and other varieties of Islam, not very different from the situation that existed between Tamilians and Sinhalese but for some reason, incomprehensible to me, we want to separate them and view them as different ideologies. Let's think through this scenario, What would have happened had India secretly intervened and armed, trained LTTE when SL army was massacring Tamilians on the orders of Rajpaksa, would he have been successful in eliminating LTTE? Better yet, Pakistan, China jumps into the fray and supports Sri Lanka and some other country comes to support India and LTTE. What would that have resulted into?

?

Other HALF??? more like 99% of the blame is iSlam. Stop being so blind.

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:32 pm

what are the governments of the middle east doing to contain this scourge? after all this is their neighborhood.

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:45 pm

Kris wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship
>>>Here is the problem with that theory. Governmental sponsors can change their minds or can be persuaded due to economic or political considerations. When you think your marching orders are from God and death is a doorway to a physical paradise , you have a whole different ballgame. And if the cause is based some idiotic world-view based on a literal interpretation of religion and you have no capacity to question it or are not allowed to, you are screwed. That by itself may not be a problem for others. It is when you start killing others for this cause, it becomes their problem as well.

See my response to Marthaadi and tell me why was Rajiv Gandhi assassinated, was he a Tamilian or of Sinhalese descent? and to your other point, superpowers are yet to or unable to persuade those state sponsors, for whatever reason; until then we're going to have to suffer through these horrific tragedies and hope we will be lucky enough not to be near those barbaric attacks.

by Guest Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:56 pm

goodcitizn wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:I am waiting to see how many Islamic countries, including Indonesia, openly condemn this horrible massacre of civilians by Islamic extremists/terrorists.

....Oh...many of them have already paid their "lip service" for the iSlamo lovers as reason to show how peaceful the muslims are.

But, they would not isolate them or throw them out of iSlam or act against them. Bcz, even if they are not true muslims, they are still muslims after all and they ARE carrying out Koran's diktat wonly.

Look how easily people like CD area justifying the Paris attack (earlier 26/11) and blaming it on the French Govt.

Upps, I was not talking about independent groups of muslims voicing their disapproval of such acts; my comment was about muslim countries. So far I have heard only the President of Afghanistan denounce such attacks.

http://muslimmatters.org/2015/11/14/what-muslims-are-saying-about-the-paris-attacks/

by Kris Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:06 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:maoists had economic goals, LTTE at least in the beginning had civil rights goals. i don't know of any organization or ideology with such a nihilistic world view that transcends national and linguistic identities. i don't think you can compare radical islam to anything else we know or have seen before.
Because none of those outfits had state sponsored resources (monetary, military) at their disposal. Imagine the outcome had Indian govt sponsored LTTE or let's not forget the mayhem from the 80s in j&k and Punjab where extremist outfits benefited from Pakistan's sponsorship
>>>Here is the problem with that theory. Governmental sponsors can change their minds or can be persuaded due to economic or political considerations. When you think your marching orders are from God and death is a doorway to a physical paradise , you have a whole different ballgame. And if the cause is based some idiotic world-view based on a literal interpretation of religion and you have no capacity to question it or are not allowed to, you are screwed. That by itself may not be a problem for others. It is when you start killing others for this cause, it becomes their problem as well.
See my response to Marthaadi and tell me why was Rajiv Gandhi assassinated, was he a Tamilian or of Sinhalese descent? and to your other point, superpowers are yet to or unable to persuade those state sponsors, for whatever reason; until then we're going to have to suffer through these horrific tragedies and hope we will be lucky enough not to be near those barbaric attacks.

>>>I am not sure what this parallel is meant to demonstrate. Your original point was what would have happened if the Indian government had supported LTTE. My point was that governments can be persuaded to stop it, whereas a belief in an all knowing god and paradise is not something that can be countered that easily. Superpowers can persuade governments. For instance, Pakistan's governmental support for the taliban is not what it was 15 years ago, because of US pressure. With regard to the mischief in kashmir, if there is going to be economic sanctions from the US, you will see a different tune. That non-state actors or parallel governments continue with the mischief is precisely because they are playing up the islamic martyrdom/paradise angle.

by southindian Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:09 pm

Mumun, that was a funny post.

by Kris Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:35 pm

Rashmun wrote:in the Paris attack the attackers were reportedly using kalashnikovs and grenades. The question is: since these guys obviously lack the ability to manufacture these weapons on their own, how did they get access to them?

>>>It is a lot easier than you would think. Given the proximity to the middle east hot spots where these are freely available, I would imagine this is not an issue. One of the areas the West is underestimating these guys is in the area of their tactical sophistication. They have already recruited home grown talent in Western Europe primarily from the immigrant muslim communities. Many of the radical mosques are central hubs in this effort and know they can fly under the radar, given the political correctness diktats under which the governments operate. Once you have these cells in place, it is not difficult to prosecute a very low budget war against the West. A few bombs here and some kalashnikov shootouts there can cause mayhem and helplessness and voila, you have the citizens and governments on full defensive mode.

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:40 pm

Kris wrote:
>>>I am not sure what this parallel is meant to demonstrate. Your original point was what would have happened if the Indian government had supported LTTE. My point was that governments can be persuaded to stop it, whereas a belief in an all knowing god and paradise is not something that can be countered that easily.

My point was which god or paradise was the reason for Rajiv Gandhi's assassination? He was seen as an interventionist just as France and the US are seen as.

Kris wrote:Superpowers can persuade governments. For instance, Pakistan's governmental support for the taliban is not what it was 15 years ago, because of US pressure. With regard to the mischief in kashmir, if there is going to be economic sanctions from the US, you will see a different tune. That non-state actors or parallel governments continue with the mischief is precisely because they are playing up the islamic martyrdom/paradise angle.

Yes, the operative word is "can" but they are not willing to do that. Until such time where "realpolitik" takes a back seat and human lives are valued, nothing will change; we can shout our lungs out as much as we can - blaming Islamic martyrdom/paradise - but nothing will change, they are merely pawns in the hands of superpowers. In a nutshell, nothing will change in our lifetime.

by SomeProfile Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:26 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:54 pm

SomeProfile wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

Comprehension issues? That was in reference to Max's point about young men and women gravitating towards certain ideologies

by Propagandhi711 Sat Nov 14, 2015 5:27 pm

SomeProfile wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

what I find laughable about reverend comrade reddy is how he gets hypersensitive and spittingly mad about every little thing that happens in some far flung corner of india, but suddenly turns "contemplative" and "understanding", "wanting to look at socioeconomichistoricaldietaryclimate reasons before condemning others" when his adopted ummah fellows do far, far worse. it's called wearing blinders. same with the frustrated stock phrase employing french beard faux intellectual with an abiding love for gay love with bearded muzzie cooks.

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 6:44 pm

Propagandhi711 wrote:
SomeProfile wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

what I find laughable about reverend comrade reddy is how he gets hypersensitive and spittingly mad about every little thing that happens in some far flung corner of india, but suddenly turns "contemplative" and "understanding", "wanting to look at socioeconomichistoricaldietaryclimate reasons before condemning others" when his adopted ummah fellows do far, far worse. it's called wearing blinders. same with the frustrated stock phrase employing french beard faux intellectual with an abiding love for gay love with bearded muzzie cooks.

Let me repeat very slowly for your benefit. When I said all ideologies are about the same, wasn't I being "contemplative" and "understanding" of all? so much for your garbled logic.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sat Nov 14, 2015 6:53 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:
SomeProfile wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:you can fight a war against an army and against individuals, but how do you fight a war against a medieval ideology that ensnares so many young men and women?
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

what I find laughable about reverend comrade reddy is how he gets hypersensitive and spittingly mad about every little thing that happens in some far flung corner of india, but suddenly turns "contemplative" and "understanding", "wanting to look at socioeconomichistoricaldietaryclimate reasons before condemning others" when his adopted ummah fellows do far, far worse. it's called wearing blinders. same with the frustrated stock phrase employing french beard faux intellectual with an abiding love for gay love with bearded muzzie cooks.
Let me repeat very slowly for your benefit. When I said all ideologies are about the same, wasn't I being "contemplative" and "understanding" of all? so much for your garbled logic.

So which one is worse....(not that I expect you to answer this) ?

The lynching incident in Dadri in which a muslim was killed

OR

Paris attacks where some 120+ people are gunned down by the muslim terrorists ?

by confuzzled dude Sat Nov 14, 2015 7:34 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:
SomeProfile wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Are we sure that this is different from other ideologies? Maoist ideology still attracts a lot of [educated] young men and women. If LTTE and Khalistan were to face the wrath of the global war or the Hindutva-wadis were armed, trained and funded by some of the powerful countries and then dumped, would they have reacted any differently? I'm talking about an average human's psyche, which precisely why it is not easy for one to turn into a Buddha like or a Gandhi like.

Here's no. 1 reason why I call him Confused Douche. Apparently, ISIS's actions are due to the "average human's psyche" (see bolded statement above)!

what I find laughable about reverend comrade reddy is how he gets hypersensitive and spittingly mad about every little thing that happens in some far flung corner of india, but suddenly turns "contemplative" and "understanding", "wanting to look at socioeconomichistoricaldietaryclimate reasons before condemning others" when his adopted ummah fellows do far, far worse. it's called wearing blinders. same with the frustrated stock phrase employing french beard faux intellectual with an abiding love for gay love with bearded muzzie cooks.
Let me repeat very slowly for your benefit. When I said all ideologies are about the same, wasn't I being "contemplative" and "understanding" of all? so much for your garbled logic.

So which one is worse....(not that I expect you to answer this) ?

The lynching incident in Dadri in which a muslim was killed

OR

Paris attacks where some 120+ people are gunned down by the muslim terrorists ?

You should be happy that good samaritans in India are trying to nip it in the bud before this fanaticism escalates to the next level

by Kris Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:36 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
>>>I am not sure what this parallel is meant to demonstrate. Your original point was what would have happened if the Indian government had supported LTTE. My point was that governments can be persuaded to stop it, whereas a belief in an all knowing god and paradise is not something that can be countered that easily.
My point was which god or paradise was the reason for Rajiv Gandhi's assassination? He was seen as an interventionist just as France and the US are seen as.
Kris wrote:Superpowers can persuade governments. For instance, Pakistan's governmental support for the taliban is not what it was 15 years ago, because of US pressure. With regard to the mischief in kashmir, if there is going to be economic sanctions from the US, you will see a different tune. That non-state actors or parallel governments continue with the mischief is precisely because they are playing up the islamic martyrdom/paradise angle.
Yes, the operative word is "can" but they are not willing to do that. Until such time where "realpolitik" takes a back seat and human lives are valued, nothing will change; we can shout our lungs out as much as we can - blaming Islamic martyrdom/paradise - but nothing will change, they are merely pawns in the hands of superpowers. In a nutshell, nothing will change in our lifetime.

1) No god or paradise motivated the LTTE which is why that MO is gone. I mean once they got wiped out, did anyone reconstitute themselves with the same ideology of killing of anyone seen as interventionist? This is because, even if the feelings toward Sinhalese suppression remain and are real, the problem is seen as a human one and not due to any god-given special status with paradise access through killing.

2) I would disagree. For your position to be true i.e. the idea that superpower politics is solely or even mainly the trigger to these acts, you have to show that any conflict that fundamentalist islam with other cultures (now or in history) has/had US or Western involvement. There are various theaters (Philippines, Thailand, Kashmir, Nigeria) where the West is not even peripherally involved. Speaking of realpolitik, that may very well be what is needed to get our arms around this tactically. Instead of fighting a war by Marquess of Queensberry rules (and spending billions and thousands of lives), this has to be tackled at the ground level covertly by neutralizing the brains behind this. See my post in the other thread about the talking heads yapping 24/7 on TV. This is guerilla warfare we are being confronted with. If that is seen as underhanded, you have to then censure Obama for killing Bin Laden by entering Pakistani airspace illegally or Kennedy for the Cuban blockade as that infringed on Cuba's right to strike a deal with the Soviets.

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:04 pm

the news that one of the dead guys had a passport that was processed in greece and may have gotten in with the refugee stream from syria is going to really fire up the right wingers in europe. it won't be easy for the refugees already there and will make it much harder for future refugees.

btw what is it about france that makes it such a desired target?

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Nov 14, 2015 11:20 pm

and i just can't wait to see how this plays out in the GOP election narrative. i am sure somehow they'll find a way to blame this on obama and hillary. and i am even more excited to hear the fart-filled braggadocio that's about to emanate from the mouths of messers trump, cruz, rubio et al in the coming days and weeks. we are about to find out how they'll crush ISIS to a pulp.

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