gandhi - what you like and dislike

by truthbetold Thu Oct 02, 2014 5:04 am

Peace. We exchange barbs everyday. But since today is Gandhi jayanti, let us exchange ideas about him.

Say two or three things about him you like and dislike.

Like:
his humble life style
his leadership in rallying Indians in peaceful resistance to colonial rule
swadesi movement

Dislike
His obstinate style of leadership

by confuzzled dude Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:15 am

Simplicity and minimalism, he was ultimate minimalist unlike our erudite, expensive designer clothes wearing, don't practice what you preach pompous ass PM.

by Guest Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:23 am

I liked some of the things he said in his book, MEWT about speaking th truth, taking the tough stand, cleanliness, health, etc... the one thing that sticks out to me, and I try to do it but can't is, 'never lose your temper in public, you lose respect instantly, whether you are right or wrong'. Something like that. I think there's a lot of truth in that.

what I disliked - hmm. many things. but overall, I think he wasn't as completely honest and righteous about many things, as much as he portrayed.

by Seva Lamberdar Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:36 am

truthbetold wrote:Peace. We exchange barbs everyday. But since today is Gandhi jayanti, let us exchange ideas about him.

Say two or three things about him you like and dislike.

Like:
his humble life style
his leadership in rallying Indians in peaceful resistance to colonial rule
swadesi movement

Dislike
His obstinate style of leadership

Gandhi's greatest contribution was in making the ordinary people on the subcontinent aware and proud of themselves as Indians socially and politically. It's like creating the social and political identity for the nation.

by pravalika nanda Thu Oct 02, 2014 10:59 am

** using civil disobedience to garner support for the quit india movement. he was a shrewd man.
** for taking the bullet, for being truly a warrior.
** i like the last words he said when he died. he went in peace.

--I did not care for his silly dhoti. he should've worn a lungi.
--I don't know what he saw in Nehru. Nehru was nothing like the average indian man. He would've been good for the IFS or as a secretary of state. And of course Nehru gave us the Gandhi oligarchy.
--Gandhi himself did not promote any of his family members which is a good thing but I've read that he had done foolish things such as deny them proper schooling etc cuz he didn't believe it. So his progeny live in poverty. None of our business really but I was surprised to learn that.

by Propagandhi711 Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:05 am

confuzzled dude wrote:Simplicity and minimalism, he was ultimate minimalist unlike our erudite, expensive designer clothes wearing, don't practice what you preach pompous ass PM.

bit rich, coming from "a little corruption chalta hai" when it comes to nephew and uncle.

butt hurt shows no signs of abating

by southindian Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:09 am

confuzzled dude wrote:Simplicity and minimalism, he was ultimate minimalist unlike our erudite, expensive designer clothes wearing, don't practice what you preach pompous ass PM.

Wrong!

Many Armani wearing Americans (Bill Gates foundation) and Indians (Premji) do more for the poor than ALL great-arm-chair-critics-combine on this forum.

You just don't know what being simple means. You only SEE IF SOMEONE is simple and practices minimalism.

by pravalika nanda Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:13 am

confuzzled dude wrote:Simplicity and minimalism, he was ultimate minimalist unlike our erudite, expensive designer clothes wearing, don't practice what you preach pompous ass PM.ii

I want to reassure you that once the modi wave dies down, there will be a sonia fuckfest (which I heartily wish upon the secular elites) cuz such is the nature of politics so in the interim just stick to the topic of MG.

by southindian Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:13 am

truthbetold wrote:Peace. We exchange barbs everyday. But since today is Gandhi jayanti, let us exchange ideas about him.

Say two or three things about him you like and dislike.

Like:
his humble life style
his leadership in rallying Indians in peaceful resistance to colonial rule
swadesi movement

Dislike
His obstinate style of leadership

Gandhi was an OBSNTINATE and I love that. He had humility.

by seven Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:36 pm

I like how determined he was. I don't like he steels all limelight from Lal Bahadur Shastri. LBS seems like a very humble accomplished person as well.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Thu Oct 02, 2014 1:00 pm

truthbetold wrote:Peace. We exchange barbs everyday. But since today is Gandhi jayanti, let us exchange ideas about him.

Say two or three things about him you like and dislike.

Like:
his humble life style
his leadership in rallying Indians in peaceful resistance to colonial rule
swadesi movement

Dislike
His obstinate style of leadership

He - perhaps, more than anyone else - brought out the modern concept of INDIA by uniting the people with a focused objective. But for him, India could well have been at least 10 to 20 different countries - like Europe.

He was simple and did not change his style - overtly or covertly till the end.

He foresake power - which is the prime reason for democratic roots to take hold in India.

But, he was autocratic, VERY political (he did not want to be accused of favoring another Gujju - Patel to be the PM), and picking Nehru as the PM instead of Rajaji or Morarji or Kamaraj.

by Kayalvizhi Thu Oct 02, 2014 7:09 pm

Dislike -
his hypocrisy.

Another separate item. If you do not do my wat (even if majority supports the other way), I will just walk out

In a way he started the Delhi high Command dictating to state congeess

by Seva Lamberdar Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:14 am

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
truthbetold wrote:Peace. We exchange barbs everyday. But since today is Gandhi jayanti, let us exchange ideas about him.

Say two or three things about him you like and dislike.

Like:
his humble life style
his leadership in rallying Indians in peaceful resistance to colonial rule
swadesi movement

Dislike
His obstinate style of leadership

He - perhaps, more than anyone else - brought out the modern concept of INDIA by uniting the people with a focused objective. But for him, India could well have been at least 10 to 20 different countries - like Europe.

He was simple and did not change his style - overtly or covertly till the end.

He foresake power - which is the prime reason for democratic roots to take hold in India.

But, he was autocratic, VERY political (he did not want to be accused of favoring another Gujju - Patel to be the PM), and picking Nehru as the PM instead of Rajaji or Morarji or Kamaraj.

That was most likely the payback for Motilal Nehru (Jawaharlal's father) joining the Congress party long ago at Gandhi's insistence. Before that the Congress was seen basically as a fringe outfit led by Gandhi and hardly anyone of considerable means and education etc. cared about it and its dreams of Independence (self-rule) for India. As Motilal, who was one of richest and well-educated fellows (including as a foreign educated lawyer), joined Congress, the party got the much-needed credibility and also a lot of money from him. Then many other famous and rich fellows join the party, following Motilal's example. Motilal's son (Jawaharlal) too came into the party later.

by Maria S Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:05 am

Obviously one-of-kind.

His simplicity, courage, intelligence,brilliant strategies, sense of humor-wit.

He was straight forward about his weaknesses- and was complex..had qualities of history-changing leaders..."healthy" narcisisstic (not in appearance, but persona), grandiose and had his share of prejudices (gender, race, caste).

Having said that..had the ability to have "personal affection and friendships" with people..from different faiths, nationalities and backgrounds.

Read this book by Dr. Stanley Jones (a Christian missionary), who am sure will trigger all kinds of lashing out in this forum.."Portrait of a Friend"

http://www.amazon.com/Gandhi-Portrayal-Friend-Abingdon-Classics/dp/0687138701#

Anyways..it's an interesting book..Dr. Martin Luther King..called this one of the best books, which
attracted him to Gandhiji..and made him even travel to India..learn more about the Non-Violent Movement Model..as he was A rising Civil Rights Movement Leader
instrumental in bringing the Civil Rights Movement in the US..to a climax and change history.

by Maria S Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:13 am

if you visit Atlanta..and interested in visiting historical sites related to the Civil Rights Movment..you can see the great influence of Gandhiji (visit will be worth it, imo).

http://quirkytravelguy.com/martin-luther-king-national-historic-site-atlanta-visit/

by Maria S Sun Oct 05, 2014 8:38 am

It is well-known that Gandhiji acknowledged his weaknesses in "experiments with truth"- including truths about lust, nicely put sexual attractions-infatuations, at least he was not a hypocrite.

I did not know about this interesting woman and..Gandhiji's mid-age love affair with Saraladebi, the niece of Rabindranath Tagore. She is bold, honest and fascinating (not to mention, nice handwriting!) no wonder he was enamoured by her..so were other men:)

http://m.outlookindia.com/article/When-Gandhi-Nearly-Slipped/292132/

Excerpts:

Saraladebi was certainly better educated than most of her contemporaries. She studied physics, a subject not generally chosen by women during that time, particularly a woman from the Tagore household. She also had a degree in English and expanded her linguistic accomplishments by studying Persian, French and Sanskrit. She had completed her Bachelor of Arts from the well-known Bethune College, and, in Bengal, acquired the reputation of a progressive, educated woman who did not hesitate to speak her mind publicly. Her autobiography often talked derisively about the effeminate Bengali man: “Dogs have teeth, cats have claws, even insects bite back if they are attacked; was it only Bengalis who kept quiet even in the face of vicious threats and assault? Was there such a lack of manhood?”A few years after she graduated, she decided to leave her ‘domestic cage’ and move south to Mysore to teach. Her parents refused permission and the rest of Tagore’s family was aghast at such a suggestion. Little is known why she chose Mysore or how she got permission but biographers have pointed out that the liberal, independent girl—who had earlier refused an invitation from Swami Vivekananda to travel with him to the West—wanted to break away to avoid the constant pressure to get married and to further challenge her own ambitions. Swami Vivekananda was so fond of her that he gave her a copy of all his writings, including Rajjog, each inscribed ‘Given with love’. On returning from his world tour, Swami Vivekananda introduced her to cuisine from France, America, Norway and other countries, often doing the cooking himself.

1920, Gandhi said at a speech at a citizen’s meeting in Hyderabad that he “was taking Saraladebi all over India with him as she better understood his swadeshi principles than his wife”, though he did complain that she too did not practice the use of swadeshi cloth to his entire satisfaction.

On more than one occasion he described a dream he had in which she had come to travel with him, leaving behind her husband. Gandhi even brought her to the Sabarmati Ashram as an honoured guest. Their relationship was so close that people often considered them a couple deeply involved with each other. The relationship was also so public that those in Gandhi’s closest circle became extremely concerned. Eminent lawyer and political activist C. Rajagopalachari, the first governor-general of independent India, was so disturbed that he wrote a strong letter to Gandhi, describing the difference between Saraladebi and Kasturba “as a kerosene oil lamp and the morning sun”. Despite this, Gandhi said he missed her when they were not together, and when she came to the Sabarmati Ashram they had their meals, contrary to ashram rules, in a separate room sitting on mattress bed rather than in the main dining area.

Their exchanges are like e-mails between lovers-or passages written by a romance novelist.

On October 16, she writes to Gandhi, “You are adding a new sin to my many old ones...that of jealousy...do you mean to say I am jealous of you? I can only laugh at this charge and wonder at your biased reading of me....”

On December 4, 1920, Gandhi wrote to Saraladebi: “I shall not deliberately omit to write to you. But you must cultivate patience and trust. You may not accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner. Among lovers and friends there is neither sinner not saint.” Again on December 11, Gandhi, clearly getting irritated at her possessiveness, wrote to her while travelling from Motihari to Bhagalpur in Bihar: “I had two letters from you, one a scrap, the other a longish letter which shows you do not understand my language or my thoughts.... You are hugging your defect even when they are pointed out by a friend.... I do not want to quarrel with you. In you I have an enigma to solve.”

____

Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

by goodcitizn Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:32 am

Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

by Maria S Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:01 am

goodcitizn wrote:
Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

GC, that seems to apply so perfectly here!

Appreciate the mention, still make cameo appearances. As you say..the same issues discussed over and over again, and the same posters taking the same predictable positions and swipes becomes tedious and boring. When someone makes it clear they only see you "only" as someone from a different religion, group, tribe..etc and nothing more (after years and years), that's not enticing at all!

But, that's something the majority has to decide..if they are satisfied with what it is, it is what it is:)

Nice to see you! take care.

by Kris Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:33 am

Maria S wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:
Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

GC, that seems to apply so perfectly here!

Appreciate the mention, still make cameo appearances. As you say..the same issues discussed over and over again, and the same posters taking the same predictable positions and swipes becomes tedious and boring. When someone makes it clear they only see you "only" as someone from a different religion, group, tribe..etc and nothing more (after years and years), that's not enticing at all!

But, that's something the majority has to decide..if they are satisfied with what it is, it is what it is:)

Nice to see you! take care.

>>>>Good morning Maria. I guess I missed this thread.

Gandhi + points:

1) Shrewd tactician. The Salt Satyagraha was a brilliant case of switching the venue where the foe is stripped of his advantages. The battle became one based on laws as opposed to one based on strength of manpower and weaponry. The Brits were caught flatfooted.

2) Did not play dirty. Decent to a fault.

3) Perhaps most importantly, had the fundamental belief that freedom is the default option.

- points:

1)Assumed the world was made of Gandhis.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:05 am

goodcitizn wrote:
Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

...CN. Annadurai's supposed "Padi ThaAnDiya Pathini - his supposed mistress

and...

...of course...In memory of his wife Rani Annadurai...

by goodcitizn Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:38 pm

Maria S wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:
Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

GC, that seems to apply so perfectly here!

Appreciate the mention, still make cameo appearances. As you say..the same issues discussed over and over again, and the same posters taking the same predictable positions and swipes becomes tedious and boring. When someone makes it clear they only see you "only" as someone from a different religion, group, tribe..etc and nothing more (after years and years), that's not enticing at all!

But, that's something the majority has to decide..if they are satisfied with what it is, it is what it is:)

Nice to see you! take care.

Amaam, araichcha maava araikkaraanga, thovachcha thuniya thovaikkaraanga!

Have a nice Sunday, Maria!

by goodcitizn Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:41 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
goodcitizn wrote:
Maria S wrote:Amused by the Gandhiji's way with words.."accuse me of sainthood and dignify yourself as sinner"!

If these two lived today carrying on like they did- entertaining the media, history may have been different:)

Reminds me of what Annadurai said when asked to comment on his relationship with a movie actress: "Naan mutrum thurandha munivarum alla, avaL padi thaandaa pathiniyum alla".

...CN. Annadurai's supposed "Padi ThaAnDiya Pathini - his supposed mistress

and...

...of course...In memory of his wife Rani Annadurai...

Saamiyov, didn't realize there is a street named after Annadurai's wife. Frankly they ought to put a moratorium on the number of streets and buildings named after politicians, let alone their wives.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:43 pm

goodcitizn wrote:
Amaam, araichcha maava araikkaraanga, thovachcha thuniya thovaikkaraanga!

Have a nice Sunday, Maria!

thOvachai ThunaiyE azhukkuNu sollitiKitaaE irunDha tuniyE adichikiitaaE irrukka vendiyathu Thaan.

Adikka adikka ammiyum Nagarum. - Ex. Rev Flimmy Iyer.

by goodcitizn Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:52 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
Adikka adikka ammiyum Nagarum. - Ex. Rev Flimmy Iyer.

by truthbetold Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:19 pm

You guys provide english translation.

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