MulaiAzhagi wrote:===> Is there any historical evidence as to it was the disciple Thomas who came to India?

Looks like it is one of the canards spread by missionaries similar to the nonsense that Jesus died in Kashmir.

Jeremiah Mburuburu wrote:the article, in the march, 2012 issue of the national geographic magazine, is entitled "the apostles." some of it is about the syrian christians (of kerala) whom the magazine refers to as thomas christians*.

here's a link to the article:

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/03/apostles/todhunter-text

excerpts:

In the town of Parur, India, in the southern state of Kerala, the polished stone floor of the old church of Kottakkavu gleams so brightly that it mirrors the crimson, pine green, and gold-upon-gold altarpiece like a reflecting pool... On this site, tradition says, Thomas founded the first Christian church in India, in A.D. 52.

...Thomas the Apostle went east, through what is now Syria and Iran and, historians believe, on down to southern India. He traveled farther than even the indefatigable Paul, whose journeys encompassed much of the Mediterranean.

...Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore**. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai.

...Unlike later Christian groups in Asia who were converted by missionaries, Thomas Christians believe their church was founded by one of Christ's closest followers, and this is central to their spiritual identity. "They are an apostolic church," Stewart said...

end of excerpts.

* this appears to be the modern name; the malayalee name is "suriyani kristhiani" (english: "syrian christian," probably a misnomer), and the ancient name, "nazrani."

** the malayalam name, i think, is kodunganallur.

Rashmun wrote:
i found two interesting things in this article:

1. Even Hindus pray to St. George, the dragon slayer, believing he may offer their children protection from cobras.

2. Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai. At Palayur Church in Guruvayur, Thomas is said to have raised the first cross in India and performed one of his earliest miracles: When he encountered a group of Brahmans throwing water into the air as part of a ritual, he asked why the water fell back to Earth if it was pleasing to their deity. My God, Thomas said, would accept such an offering. He then flung a great spray into the air, and the droplets hung there in the form of glistening white blossoms. Most onlookers converted on the spot; the rest fled.

Rashmun wrote:

Jeremiah Mburuburu wrote:the article, in the march, 2012 issue of the national geographic magazine, is entitled "the apostles." some of it is about the syrian christians (of kerala) whom the magazine refers to as thomas christians*.

here's a link to the article:

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/03/apostles/todhunter-text

excerpts:

In the town of Parur, India, in the southern state of Kerala, the polished stone floor of the old church of Kottakkavu gleams so brightly that it mirrors the crimson, pine green, and gold-upon-gold altarpiece like a reflecting pool... On this site, tradition says, Thomas founded the first Christian church in India, in A.D. 52.

...Thomas the Apostle went east, through what is now Syria and Iran and, historians believe, on down to southern India. He traveled farther than even the indefatigable Paul, whose journeys encompassed much of the Mediterranean.

...Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore**. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai.

...Unlike later Christian groups in Asia who were converted by missionaries, Thomas Christians believe their church was founded by one of Christ's closest followers, and this is central to their spiritual identity. "They are an apostolic church," Stewart said...

end of excerpts.

* this appears to be the modern name; the malayalee name is "suriyani kristhiani" (english: "syrian christian," probably a misnomer), and the ancient name, "nazrani."

** the malayalam name, i think, is kodunganallur.

i found two interesting things in this article:

1. Even Hindus pray to St. George, the dragon slayer, believing he may offer their children protection from cobras.

2. Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai. At Palayur Church in Guruvayur, Thomas is said to have raised the first cross in India and performed one of his earliest miracles: When he encountered a group of Brahmans throwing water into the air as part of a ritual, he asked why the water fell back to Earth if it was pleasing to their deity. My God, Thomas said, would accept such an offering. He then flung a great spray into the air, and the droplets hung there in the form of glistening white blossoms. Most onlookers converted on the spot; the rest fled.

Hellsangel wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ni%C3%B1o_Dios_of_Mexico

HTH

Rashmun wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

Jeremiah Mburuburu wrote:the article, in the march, 2012 issue of the national geographic magazine, is entitled "the apostles." some of it is about the syrian christians (of kerala) whom the magazine refers to as thomas christians*.

here's a link to the article:

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/03/apostles/todhunter-text

excerpts:

In the town of Parur, India, in the southern state of Kerala, the polished stone floor of the old church of Kottakkavu gleams so brightly that it mirrors the crimson, pine green, and gold-upon-gold altarpiece like a reflecting pool... On this site, tradition says, Thomas founded the first Christian church in India, in A.D. 52.

...Thomas the Apostle went east, through what is now Syria and Iran and, historians believe, on down to southern India. He traveled farther than even the indefatigable Paul, whose journeys encompassed much of the Mediterranean.

...Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore**. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai.

...Unlike later Christian groups in Asia who were converted by missionaries, Thomas Christians believe their church was founded by one of Christ's closest followers, and this is central to their spiritual identity. "They are an apostolic church," Stewart said...

end of excerpts.

* this appears to be the modern name; the malayalee name is "suriyani kristhiani" (english: "syrian christian," probably a misnomer), and the ancient name, "nazrani."

** the malayalam name, i think, is kodunganallur.

i found two interesting things in this article:

1. Even Hindus pray to St. George, the dragon slayer, believing he may offer their children protection from cobras.

2. Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai. At Palayur Church in Guruvayur, Thomas is said to have raised the first cross in India and performed one of his earliest miracles: When he encountered a group of Brahmans throwing water into the air as part of a ritual, he asked why the water fell back to Earth if it was pleasing to their deity. My God, Thomas said, would accept such an offering. He then flung a great spray into the air, and the droplets hung there in the form of glistening white blossoms. Most onlookers converted on the spot; the rest fled.

--> I have noticed a kind of hindu-christian syncretism in some parts of south india. for instance, worshipping jesus christ as a young child which is so highly reminiscent of worshipping Lord Krishna as a young child. i have not seen such statues or paintings of jesus--as a young child-- anywhere else in the world other than certain regions in south india.

Rashmun wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

Jeremiah Mburuburu wrote:the article, in the march, 2012 issue of the national geographic magazine, is entitled "the apostles." some of it is about the syrian christians (of kerala) whom the magazine refers to as thomas christians*.

here's a link to the article:

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/03/apostles/todhunter-text

excerpts:

In the town of Parur, India, in the southern state of Kerala, the polished stone floor of the old church of Kottakkavu gleams so brightly that it mirrors the crimson, pine green, and gold-upon-gold altarpiece like a reflecting pool... On this site, tradition says, Thomas founded the first Christian church in India, in A.D. 52.

...Thomas the Apostle went east, through what is now Syria and Iran and, historians believe, on down to southern India. He traveled farther than even the indefatigable Paul, whose journeys encompassed much of the Mediterranean.

...Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore**. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai.

...Unlike later Christian groups in Asia who were converted by missionaries, Thomas Christians believe their church was founded by one of Christ's closest followers, and this is central to their spiritual identity. "They are an apostolic church," Stewart said...

end of excerpts.

* this appears to be the modern name; the malayalee name is "suriyani kristhiani" (english: "syrian christian," probably a misnomer), and the ancient name, "nazrani."

** the malayalam name, i think, is kodunganallur.

i found two interesting things in this article:

1. Even Hindus pray to St. George, the dragon slayer, believing he may offer their children protection from cobras.

2. Many historians believe that Thomas landed on the palm-lined coast of Kerala at a site now called Cranganore. He is reported to have established seven churches in Kerala and to have been martyred 20 years later on the other side of the country, in Mylapore, now a neighborhood in Chennai. At Palayur Church in Guruvayur, Thomas is said to have raised the first cross in India and performed one of his earliest miracles: When he encountered a group of Brahmans throwing water into the air as part of a ritual, he asked why the water fell back to Earth if it was pleasing to their deity. My God, Thomas said, would accept such an offering. He then flung a great spray into the air, and the droplets hung there in the form of glistening white blossoms. Most onlookers converted on the spot; the rest fled.

--> I have noticed a kind of hindu-christian syncretism in some parts of south india. for instance, worshipping jesus christ as a young child which is so highly reminiscent of worshipping Lord Krishna as a young child. i have not seen such statues or paintings of jesus--as a young child-- anywhere else in the world other than certain regions in south india.

notice the usage of the word 'martyred' in connection with Thomas. The usage of this word means that Thomas was killed while doing missionary activity (to put it crudely, trying to convert people to Christianity). One may contrast this with the three jesuit missions which went to the court of the mughal emperor Akbar the great. Akbar gave them full freedom to make converts and even handed over one of his sons (Murad) to the Jesuit missionaries for education. The Jesuits would begin and end each study lesson of Prince Murad with a Biblical prayer, and Akbar had no objection to this.
One of the Jesuits at Akbar's court--Aquaviva--went back to Goa (the jesuits had originally come to Goa) to do missionary work there where we are informed that he was 'martyred'.

Hellsangel wrote:Cue. Trumpets. Akbar makes his appearance after being MIA for the last few days!

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:all roads lead to akbar.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:on CH they do.

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:on CH they do.

no they do not. I never mentioned Akbar in all my posts on the Indian schools of philosophy for instance.

the Akbar Upanishad and Allah Upanishad are examples,^[27] having been written in the 17th century in praise of Islamic ideas at the insistence of Dara Shikoh.[2]

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:on CH they do.

no they do not. I never mentioned Akbar in all my posts on the Indian schools of philosophy for instance.

from wikipedia (your next research topic):

the Akbar Upanishad and Allah Upanishad are examples,^[27] having been written in the 17th century in praise of Islamic ideas at the insistence of Dara Shikoh.[2]

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:get with the program. synthesis man synthesis. akbar and upanishad in the same sentence. this is your wet dream!

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:just being helpful with your synthesis researches.

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:just being helpful with your synthesis researches.

synthesis is not to be done arbitrarily. rather it is to be done judiciously wherever appropriate it suits me.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:he is the director of the public synthesisworks department (the PSWD). we need to get a notarized form in triplicate signed by the diro before we can begin any synthesis projects.