Is the most powerful man in India, after Modi, going to be a UPwalah?

by Guest Sun May 25, 2014 12:38 pm

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

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This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 1:54 pm

Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

by Guest Sun May 25, 2014 2:18 pm

Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

Can u explain to me why Jaitley is a good choice for finance? The guy is a lawyer, not an economist.

by truthbetold Sun May 25, 2014 2:25 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

Can u explain to me why Jaitley is a good choice for finance? The guy is a lawyer, not an economist.

Chidambaram is also a lawyer.

by Vakavaka Pakapaka Sun May 25, 2014 3:12 pm

Hmm....

Looks like Modi is saying that UP bhaiyyas prosper by working for Gujaratis. Last time when Modi said that, you criticized him.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 4:44 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

Can u explain to me why Jaitley is a good choice for finance? The guy is a lawyer, not an economist.

>>>Jaitley has represented multinationals and is pro reformist. While he has been critical of rajan's holding the line on the interest rates, he has not called for throwing him out. Looks like he has walked a fine line on that. All this will bode well in terms of the market's reaction.

by truthbetold Sun May 25, 2014 5:44 pm

Rash,

As a follow up to past FM's qualifications, only krishnamachari and mms are real economists since in 1960s. Subramaniam and VP singh are successfull as they used the budgets to meet other policy efforts.

by confuzzled dude Sun May 25, 2014 7:32 pm

Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

Can u explain to me why Jaitley is a good choice for finance? The guy is a lawyer, not an economist.
>>>Jaitley has represented multinationals and is pro reformist. While he has been critical of rajan's holding the line on the interest rates, he has not called for throwing him out. Looks like he has walked a fine line on that. All this will bode well in terms of the market's reaction.

Hmm.. Congress like strategy is alright when our party follows it?! This Jaitely guy if he can't win now probably can not win ever. How fair is it for all the other candidates that won? I don't think these elite foreign educated guys are any better than ordinary folk. Idiots like Jairam Ramesh, Tahroor, Swamy and Chidambaram, they all have proved that time and again.

by truthbetold Sun May 25, 2014 7:50 pm

CD

Now you are posting like the CD of the past.

Jaitley while he cannot win elections, he is politically more advanced than "deer in the lights" jai Ramesh and "I know all the answers" chidambaram.

The financial policy is probably set by Modi with inputs from people like Prof. bhagat and arun shourie etc. FM is only translating that into a budget. I think jaitley can handle that.

Then there is the issue of financial and investment related structural reforms. Progress on that front will attract new investments. $60 billion is the number thrown around in papers.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 8:11 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Kris wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

>>>Ex-IMF guy-- seems like a good choice and Jaitley for Finance. So far, it seems positive.

Can u explain to me why Jaitley is a good choice for finance? The guy is a lawyer, not an economist.
>>>Jaitley has represented multinationals and is pro reformist. While he has been critical of rajan's holding the line on the interest rates, he has not called for throwing him out. Looks like he has walked a fine line on that. All this will bode well in terms of the market's reaction.
Hmm.. Congress like strategy is alright when our party follows it?! This Jaitely guy if he can't win now probably can not win ever. How fair is it for all the other candidates that won? I don't think these elite foreign educated guys are any better than ordinary folk. Idiots like Jairam Ramesh, Tahroor, Swamy and Chidambaram, they all have proved that time and again.

>>>>Winning elections is not the same as running the finance ministry. We don't ask the homecoming king to suit up for quarterback. Only time will tell how Jaitley will turn out, but he will not be the sole determinant of it. There is the broader game plan of bringing in investments and the noises being made are very much in that direction. I don't know if he was educated abroad, but from what I have read he fits the bill. The guy educated abroad post-iit is Raghuram Rajan and he does have credibility from a global perspective. I heard Swamy dropping hints about canning Rajan, but that would not be a smart move. Jaitley has expressed concern about the interest rates, but also has made reassuring comments about people who are performing will not be ousted. This shows that he can be nuanced. I didn't understand your comment about 'congress-like' strategy. It wouldn't make sense if Modi does the opposite of everything Congress did just to be different. He has to build the team that can work for him.

by MaxEntropy_Man Sun May 25, 2014 8:14 pm

i thought modi had a much better choice in jayant sinha, and i thought he may have had the courage to recruit a junior and relatively unknown person to the post of FM solely based on his experience and accomplishments. in the end he disappointingly went for paying some political dues.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun May 25, 2014 8:23 pm

Kris wrote:
>>>>Winning elections is not the same as running the finance ministry. We don't ask the homecoming king to suit up for quarterback. Only time will tell how Jaitley will turn out, but he will not be the sole determinant of it. There is the broader game plan of bringing in investments and the noises being made are very much in that direction. I don't know if he was educated abroad, but from what I have read he fits the bill. The guy educated abroad post-iit is Raghuram Rajan and he does have credibility from a global perspective. I heard Swamy dropping hints about canning Rajan, but that would not be a smart move. Jaitley has expressed concern about the interest rates, but also has made reassuring comments about people who are performing will not be ousted. This shows that he can be nuanced. I didn't understand your comment about 'congress-like' strategy. It wouldn't make sense if Modi does the opposite of everything Congress did just to be different. He has to build the team that can work for him.

Yes...remember Swamy comment about interest rates and Swift rebuttal from Rajan in Switzerland?

Swamy is from Harvard, which thinks MIT as a polytechnic and inferior. Swamy an economist from Harvard has every reason to hate Rajan - a FINANCE PhD from MIT (a not considered a harcore true economist by puritans. Rajan will never get a Nobel - no matter what).

My question why would anyone consider Swamy to be a finance minister at his age of 74?

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 8:26 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
Kris wrote:
>>>>Winning elections is not the same as running the finance ministry. We don't ask the homecoming king to suit up for quarterback. Only time will tell how Jaitley will turn out, but he will not be the sole determinant of it. There is the broader game plan of bringing in investments and the noises being made are very much in that direction. I don't know if he was educated abroad, but from what I have read he fits the bill. The guy educated abroad post-iit is Raghuram Rajan and he does have credibility from a global perspective. I heard Swamy dropping hints about canning Rajan, but that would not be a smart move. Jaitley has expressed concern about the interest rates, but also has made reassuring comments about people who are performing will not be ousted. This shows that he can be nuanced. I didn't understand your comment about 'congress-like' strategy. It wouldn't make sense if Modi does the opposite of everything Congress did just to be different. He has to build the team that can work for him.

Yes...remember Swamy comment about interest rates and Swift rebuttal from Rajan in Switzerland?

Swamy is from Harvard, which thinks MIT as a polytechnic and inferior. Swamy an economist from Harvard has every reason to hate Rajan - a FINANCE PhD from MIT (a not considered a harcore true economist by puritans. Rajan will never get a Nobel - no matter what).

My question why would anyone consider Swamy to be a finance minister at his age of 74?

>>>I thought he took a jibe at the Chicago connection.

by confuzzled dude Sun May 25, 2014 8:29 pm

Kris wrote:>>>>Winning elections is not the same as running the finance ministry. We don't ask the homecoming king to suit up for quarterback. Only time will tell how Jaitley will turn out, but he will not be the sole determinant of it. There is the broader game plan of bringing in investments and the noises being made are very much in that direction. I don't know if he was educated abroad, but from what I have read he fits the bill. The guy educated abroad post-iit is Raghuram Rajan and he does have credibility from a global perspective. I heard Swamy dropping hints about canning Rajan, but that would not be a smart move. Jaitley has expressed concern about the interest rates, but also has made reassuring comments about people who are performing will not be ousted. This shows that he can be nuanced. I didn't understand your comment about 'congress-like' strategy. It wouldn't make sense if Modi does the opposite of everything Congress did just to be different. He has to build the team that can work for him.

of course it isn't, and the same applies to every portfoilo. We need people who are not out of touch with Indian realities + have won Indian public's confidence to lead the country not some loser.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 8:37 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:>>>>Winning elections is not the same as running the finance ministry. We don't ask the homecoming king to suit up for quarterback. Only time will tell how Jaitley will turn out, but he will not be the sole determinant of it. There is the broader game plan of bringing in investments and the noises being made are very much in that direction. I don't know if he was educated abroad, but from what I have read he fits the bill. The guy educated abroad post-iit is Raghuram Rajan and he does have credibility from a global perspective. I heard Swamy dropping hints about canning Rajan, but that would not be a smart move. Jaitley has expressed concern about the interest rates, but also has made reassuring comments about people who are performing will not be ousted. This shows that he can be nuanced. I didn't understand your comment about 'congress-like' strategy. It wouldn't make sense if Modi does the opposite of everything Congress did just to be different. He has to build the team that can work for him.
of course it isn't, and the same applies to every portfoilo. We need people who are not out of touch with Indian realities + have won Indian public's confidence to lead the country not some loser.

>>CD,

The FM is going to be tasked with certain specific things presumably. This is neither a 'rewards' program, nor a popularity contest. There may be other positions within the cabinet that require the people (meaning constituents) touch, but what this is going to require is the ability to work with technocrats internally and project the idea of 'we are open for business and we can offer a stable environment to the investment community.

by confuzzled dude Sun May 25, 2014 9:02 pm

Kris wrote:
>>CD,

The FM is going to be tasked with certain specific things presumably. This is neither a 'rewards' program, nor a popularity contest. There may be other positions within the cabinet that require the people (meaning constituents) touch, but what this is going to require is the ability to work with technocrats internally and project the idea of 'we are open for business and we can offer a stable environment to the investment community.

Heck every minister is tasked with certain specific things. Secretary of the treasury, however great he may be will be useless for India as he has zero expertise on India and its needs. He needs to have an understanding of country's culture to prepare fiscal budget and what not, a person who is out of touch with it is ill suited for that job.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 9:56 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
>>CD,

The FM is going to be tasked with certain specific things presumably. This is neither a 'rewards' program, nor a popularity contest. There may be other positions within the cabinet that require the people (meaning constituents) touch, but what this is going to require is the ability to work with technocrats internally and project the idea of 'we are open for business and we can offer a stable environment to the investment community.
Heck every minister is tasked with certain specific things. Secretary of the treasury, however great he may be will be useless for India as he has zero expertise on India and its needs. He needs to have an understanding of country's culture to prepare fiscal budget and what not, a person who is out of touch with it is ill suited for that job.

>>> CD,

I think we are going round and round with this. Jaitley's portfolio is not Cultural Affairs. In the context of his job, the needs now are that not difficult to ascertain: business- friendly infrastructure & governance and stability. These are the items that engender confidence in investors.

by confuzzled dude Sun May 25, 2014 10:29 pm

Kris wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
>>CD,

The FM is going to be tasked with certain specific things presumably. This is neither a 'rewards' program, nor a popularity contest. There may be other positions within the cabinet that require the people (meaning constituents) touch, but what this is going to require is the ability to work with technocrats internally and project the idea of 'we are open for business and we can offer a stable environment to the investment community.
Heck every minister is tasked with certain specific things. Secretary of the treasury, however great he may be will be useless for India as he has zero expertise on India and its needs. He needs to have an understanding of country's culture to prepare fiscal budget and what not, a person who is out of touch with it is ill suited for that job.

>>> CD,

I think we are going round and round with this. Jaitley's portfolio is not Cultural Affairs. In the context of his job, the needs now are that not difficult to ascertain: business- friendly infrastructure & governance and stability. These are the items that engender confidence in investors.

So are defense, home, external affairs, so on and so forth.. none of these are popularity contests so why not have a few technocrats take up these functions and do away with elections.

by Kris Sun May 25, 2014 10:48 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
confuzzled dude wrote:
Kris wrote:
>>CD,

The FM is going to be tasked with certain specific things presumably. This is neither a 'rewards' program, nor a popularity contest. There may be other positions within the cabinet that require the people (meaning constituents) touch, but what this is going to require is the ability to work with technocrats internally and project the idea of 'we are open for business and we can offer a stable environment to the investment community.
Heck every minister is tasked with certain specific things. Secretary of the treasury, however great he may be will be useless for India as he has zero expertise on India and its needs. He needs to have an understanding of country's culture to prepare fiscal budget and what not, a person who is out of touch with it is ill suited for that job.

>>> CD,

I think we are going round and round with this. Jaitley's portfolio is not Cultural Affairs. In the context of his job, the needs now are that not difficult to ascertain: business- friendly infrastructure & governance and stability. These are the items that engender confidence in investors.
So are defense, home, external affairs, so on and so forth.. none of these are popularity contests so why not have a few technocrats take up these functions and do away with elections.

>>>Are you saying they should be elected?

by truthbetold Mon May 26, 2014 5:57 am

Cd
Are you hinting that India follow a Chinese type technocratic unelected regime?
A colleague of mine, of Chinese origin, told me that an important success factor behind China, 's raise is that most of its top leaders were well educated technocrats.

by confuzzled dude Mon May 26, 2014 6:59 am

truthbetold wrote:Cd
Are you hinting that India follow a Chinese type technocratic unelected regime?
A colleague of mine, of Chinese origin, told me that an important success factor behind China, 's raise is that most of its top leaders were well educated technocrats.

TBT, You meant to address to Kris, right?

by Guest Mon May 26, 2014 9:36 am

truthbetold wrote:Rash,

As a follow up to past FM's qualifications, only krishnamachari and mms are real economists since in 1960s. Subramaniam and VP singh are successfull as they used the budgets to meet other policy efforts.

I was once traveling on train with VP Singh's son. He informed me that when his dad was finance minister he would read class 12 economics/commerce books to know and understand the laws of economics. Will Jaitley be also going over class 12 books to learn how to tackle the problems facing the Indian economy?

by truthbetold Mon May 26, 2014 9:43 am

Rashmun wrote:
truthbetold wrote:Rash,

As a follow up to past FM's qualifications, only krishnamachari and mms are real economists since in 1960s. Subramaniam and VP singh are successfull as they used the budgets to meet other policy efforts.

I was once traveling on train with VP Singh's son. He informed me that when his dad was finance minister he would read class 12 economics/commerce books to know and understand the laws of economics. Will Jaitley be also going over class 12 books to learn how to tackle the problems facing the Indian economy?

Rash,

If jaitley would be as successful as VP singh in collecting taxes and catching hidden assets, I would mandate he read the same books as vp singh (even if they are children's cartoons).

by Kris Mon May 26, 2014 12:12 pm

truthbetold wrote:Cd
Are you hinting that India follow a Chinese type technocratic unelected regime?
A colleague of mine, of Chinese origin, told me that an important success factor behind China, 's raise is that most of its top leaders were well educated technocrats.

>>TBT,

If it was meant for me (CD asked me a question or alluded to this anyway in the same vein), I was referring to Jaitley not having to win an election to be FM. I was responding to CD's assertion that he may be out of touch with the common man. My point was that his role is going to entail working with technocrats internally and be able to transmit the message to the investment community that the country is pro-business and will have a stable investment climate. I am not sure why he would be especially out of touch with the citizens, but that is only peripherally relevant to my point anyway. CD's follow up question was would I prefer the country run by unelected technocrats? I am not sure how this is axiomatic in the context of what I said. The country just went through a massive election process and voted a party into power and we are talking about the PM forming his cabinet. As far as I can see, it would be a strange proposition to require that anyone he appoints also be elected.

by truthbetold Mon May 26, 2014 12:22 pm

Kris
My question was directed at Cd. He dodged by bringing your name.
I agree with your reasoning on jaitley.

by confuzzled dude Mon May 26, 2014 4:32 pm

truthbetold wrote:Kris
My question was directed at Cd. He dodged by bringing your name.
I agree with your reasoning on jaitley.

What did I dodge or dance around, TBT? Do you mind pointing that out to me.

by truthbetold Mon May 26, 2014 5:54 pm

Cd
read my question. Did you answer that question?

by SomeProfile Mon May 26, 2014 9:41 pm

Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Last I checked, Amit Shah was still a Gujarati. And not to worry, he's still gonna be the second most powerful man regardless of whether Rashmoron knows about it or not! Basketball

by confuzzled dude Mon May 26, 2014 9:44 pm

truthbetold wrote:Cd
read my question. Did you answer that question?

I read the question and it is obvious that you misunderstood the discussion most likely due to the fact that you did not go through the entire discussion that took place between me & Kris. Poor Kris tried to explain yet you're adamant that you've asked me the right question. *sigh*.

All along I was suggesting that only elected candidates (not contested but lost) should be offered portfolio. Technically savvy with no political background folks are just technocrats, they are better suited for advisory, secretary roles. More often than not they are ill suited for a ministerial role as they do connect with ordinary folks like a career politician does thus cannot make a right decision (keep in mind that a technically correct decision is not necessarily the right decision when dealing with a country full of poor).

by b_A Tue May 27, 2014 12:34 pm

Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Why do the noble people like you have tribal loyalty, Rashmun ? Was your support to dynasty is also based on tribal loyalty to the Allahabad family ?

by Guest Tue May 27, 2014 12:38 pm

b_A wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Why do the noble people like you have tribal loyalty, Rashmun ? Was your support to dynasty is also based on tribal loyalty to the Allahabad family ?

I would have felt the same if Modi would have appointed a bihari, a Bengali, a Telugu or a tamil as his top advisor.

by b_A Tue May 27, 2014 12:42 pm

Rashmun wrote:
b_A wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Why do the noble people like you have tribal loyalty, Rashmun ? Was your support to dynasty is also based on tribal loyalty to the Allahabad family ?

I would have felt the same if Modi would have appointed a bihari, a Bengali, a Telugu or a tamil as his top advisor.

In that case , your headline would've said non-Gujarati. It wouldn't have celebrated the rise of a UPwallah.

by Guest Tue May 27, 2014 12:45 pm

b_A wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
b_A wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Why do the noble people like you have tribal loyalty, Rashmun ? Was your support to dynasty is also based on tribal loyalty to the Allahabad family ?

I would have felt the same if Modi would have appointed a bihari, a Bengali, a Telugu or a tamil as his top advisor.

In that case , your headline would've said non-Gujarati. It wouldn't have celebrated the rise of a UPwallah.

Wrong. If it would have been a Telugu the title of this thread would have said Telugu.

by b_A Tue May 27, 2014 12:48 pm

b_A wrote:
Rashmun wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/report/ls-election-modi-ex-trai-chairman-nripendra-mishra-to-be-principal-secretary-in-pmo/20140525.htm

---
This is a good move by Modi. By not keeping a Gujarati as his top advisor he is demonstrating that he is not a practitioner of regional chauvinism.

Why do the noble people like you have tribal loyalty, Rashmun ? Was your support to dynasty is also based on tribal loyalty to the Allahabad family ?

I will let "the loser" have his momentary "high" feeling when he reads this post.

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