Proposed changes to ACA in the Senate bill

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:33 am

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2017/politics/obamacare-senate-bill-compare/?

by Idéfix Thu Jun 22, 2017 11:21 am

Insurers would be able to charge older customers up to five times more than they charge younger customers.

AARP will come out against this version as well. Middle-aged people in their 40s and 50s who voted for Trump to stop Mexicans, Arabs, Gays and Abortion (#MAGA) will see their insurance costs go up. Younger people who voted for Clinton will see lower premiums. If the Republicans had explicitly set out to kick their voters in the teeth, they could not have done much better than this.

Medicaid would be funded by giving states a per capita amount or block grant, beginning in 2021. The amount would grow more slowly than in the House bill, meaning bigger spending cuts overall.

Somewhere around 10 million people will lose healthcare. Several thousand will die each year due to lack of care. This is done in order fund a tax cut for the rich. There are about 500 billionaires in America, each of them will get a multi-million-dollar tax cut dripping with the blood of a few dozen Americans every year.

States would be allowed to change what qualifies as an essential health benefit.

Viagra will be covered, but not birth control or pregnancy. Millions of women will see their healthcare costs go up.

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:45 pm

Idéfix wrote:
Insurers would be able to charge older customers up to five times more than they charge younger customers.
AARP will come out against this version as well. Middle-aged people in their 40s and 50s who voted for Trump to stop Mexicans, Arabs, Gays and Abortion (#MAGA) will see their insurance costs go up. Younger people who voted for Clinton will see lower premiums. If the Republicans had explicitly set out to kick their voters in the teeth, they could not have done much better than this.

Medicaid would be funded by giving states a per capita amount or block grant, beginning in 2021. The amount would grow more slowly than in the House bill, meaning bigger spending cuts overall.
Somewhere around 10 million people will lose healthcare. Several thousand will die each year due to lack of care. This is done in order fund a tax cut for the rich. There are about 500 billionaires in America, each of them will get a multi-million-dollar tax cut dripping with the blood of a few dozen Americans every year.

States would be allowed to change what qualifies as an essential health benefit.
Viagra will be covered, but not birth control or pregnancy. Millions of women will see their healthcare costs go up.

Elections have consequences!

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jun 22, 2017 4:07 pm

Hope the snot-ball Berniebots are still enjoying their piddly jerk-off tantrum vote for Jill Stein. Elections have consequences mofos!

by silvermani Thu Jun 22, 2017 4:15 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:Hope the snot-ball Berniebots are still enjoying their piddly jerk-off tantrum vote for Jill Stein. Elections have consequences mofos!

Did Jill Stein get enough votes to tilt the balance in President Trump's favor?

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jun 22, 2017 4:18 pm

silvermani wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:Hope the snot-ball Berniebots are still enjoying their piddly jerk-off tantrum vote for Jill Stein. Elections have consequences mofos!

Did Jill Stein get enough votes to tilt the balance in President Trump's favor?

Stein votes/Trump margin:
MI: 51,463/10,704
PA: 49,678/46,765
WI: 31,006/22,177

by silvermani Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:24 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
silvermani wrote:
MaxEntropy_Man wrote:Hope the snot-ball Berniebots are still enjoying their piddly jerk-off tantrum vote for Jill Stein. Elections have consequences mofos!

Did Jill Stein get enough votes to tilt the balance in President Trump's favor?

Stein votes/Trump margin:
MI: 51,463/10,704
PA: 49,678/46,765
WI: 31,006/22,177

Fringe candidates always get some votes. I doubt Stein would have got zero votes with or without angry Bernie followers. Plus, Gary Johnson also got a good chunk of votes in those states.

MI: 173,023
PA: 142,653
WI: 106,442

He got the most number of votes than any libertarian ever. It is possible a good number of those votes were from Republican voters who didn't like Trump.

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:27 pm

Disability advocates and seniors arrested and dragged out of senate offices. Nice photo-op for the Republicans. No wonder they waited until after Handel v Ossoff to release this monstrosity.

by Idéfix Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:38 pm

Does any trumpster on SuCH believe that this bill is a good idea? Do we have any billionaires on here who stand to gain millions in tax cuts each year?

by Idéfix Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:35 pm

Promises made:

"I was the first & only potential GOP candidate to state there will be no cuts to Social Security, Medicare & Medicaid. Huckabee copied me."

Promises kept:

"I am very supportive of the Senate #HealthcareBill. Look forward to making it really special! Remember, ObamaCare is dead."

The Senate bill makes deep cuts to Medicaid and will kick over 10 million people to the curb. Many of them voted for him.

by Idéfix Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:57 pm

On the upside, to be fair to Trump and his party, the bill does benefit one small, long-suffering group that desperately needs help: CEOs of health insurance companies!

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:54 am

By the way, democratic fantasies about retaking congress in 2018 rest on wildly incorrect assumptions they make about deplorables' threshold for self-inflicted pain. The deplorables are willing to deal with untreated cancer and death before they give in to being governed by liberals.

by Idéfix Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:35 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:By the way, democratic fantasies about retaking congress in 2018 rest on wildly incorrect assumptions they make about deplorables' threshold for self-inflicted pain. The deplorables are willing to deal with untreated cancer and death before they give in to being governed by liberals.

Many Republicans will blame the Democrats for the repeal of Obamacare. Facts don't get in the way of their arguments. Republicans have blamed Obama for Katrina and 9/11.

It took four years for Kansas voters to realize the spectacular failure of the Republicans' grand experiment in trickle-down economics. They didn't hold Republicans responsible for ruining the state finances. They just elected more moderate Republicans to repeal the tax cuts.

by Idéfix Fri Jun 23, 2017 10:57 am

That old abortion issue is back again...

http://time.com/4830149/healthcare-abortion-senate-obamacare/

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:16 am

Idéfix wrote:That old abortion issue is back again...

http://time.com/4830149/healthcare-abortion-senate-obamacare/

They don't want to kill foetuses with birth defects in the womb, only after they come out of the womb by denying them coverage.

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:19 am

Anyway, time to also look into how to profit from the GOP's rape of the deplorables. I have had a long term position in UNH which has done well. Looking to add a few more healthcare stocks/mutual funds.

Also looking into long term positions in the death industry. Looking into SCI, HI etc.

by Idéfix Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:23 am

The Senate health care bill has several fatal flaws...

1. The individual mandate is gone, but preexisting coverage protections remain. This means that you as an individual can get insurance after you get sick without paying a higher premium that others in your area with similar demographics. So why would any sane healthy person buy insurance? If only sick people buy insurance, premiums in the marketplace will skyrocket and coverage will diminish. This provision will destabilize the individual market.

2. This bill rolls back the Medicaid expansion that happened under Obamacare. But it goes farther than that. In the guise of repealing Obamacare, it dismantles the Medicaid program by capping funding and pegging it to the consumer price index, when medical costs have historically risen faster than CPI. About 70 million people depend on Medicaid, and their healthcare will take a severe beating as a result of this bill. That is more people than voted for Trump.

3. The bill can pass with 50 votes (plus Pence) only if it sticks to budgetary issues. Whether insurance plans that include abortion coverage should be allowed is not a budgetary matter. So if they include restrictions on abortion coverage in the bill, the bill requires 60 votes to pass, which the Republicans do not have. If they don't include such restrictions, several conservative senators do not want to vote for the bill. I hope this conundrum kills the bill.

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:19 pm

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/mitch-mcconnell-talks-outrageous-trump-comments-and-overcoming-polio/

JUDY WOODRUFF: Finally, Senator, let’s talk about this remarkable book. You write very poignantly about when you were very young, having polio. Your mother lovingly took care of you. You got through that. And you refer back to it throughout the book. How has that affected your political life and your philosophy?

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL: It’s bound to have had a huge impact.

I mean, my mother was confronted with the following situation. Her husband was in Europe fighting the Germans. She was — moved to be with her sister in a rural community in Alabama. And there was a big polio epidemic, I subsequently found out, in 1944. And I was one of them.

And it hits you like the flu, and then, when the flu went away, you could have all different kinds of outcomes, from dying to complete recovery. Happily enough, we were one hour’s drive from Warm Springs, where President Roosevelt had set up the polio treatment center.

My mother took me over there. They trained her how to do a physical therapy regimen and said, do it four times a day. The hard part was, don’t let him start trying to walk.

And can you imagine dealing with a 2-year-old and subsequently a 3-year-old, keeping him off his feet? My first memory in life was the last visit to Warm Springs, where they told my mother I was going to be OK, I wouldn’t have to wear a brace, and I would have a normal childhood.

So, I think it was a — it had to have been an early lesson that tenacity and hard work and sticking to it that I learned from my mother, and I have tried — applied that over and over again throughout my life.

The turtle owes a lot in his life to government provided healthcare.

by silvermani Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:27 pm

Just import H1B visa medical and nursing professionals by the truckloads and crash the cost of providing medical care. Have someone develop "sharing economy" type of app for the medical field also - let hospitals bid with the lowest estimate to perform surgeries. Give tax breaks to medical establishments that provide quality care at lower cost. That should help solve the problem. Right now hospitals and doctors can charge whatever exorbitant amount they want and that needs to stop.

by Idéfix Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:41 pm

silvermani wrote:Just import H1B visa medical and nursing professionals by the truckloads and crash the cost of providing medical care.

But we don't want no more brown people. We don't like them.

silvermani wrote:Have someone develop "sharing economy" type of app for the medical field also

There are many players in this space that have created such apps. Healthcare is much more complicated than getting a ride from point A to point B, so adoption has been very spotty.

silvermani wrote:let hospitals bid with the lowest estimate to perform surgeries. Give tax breaks to medical establishments that provide quality care at lower cost. That should help solve the problem. Right now hospitals and doctors can charge whatever exorbitant amount they want and that needs to stop.

The Senate bill has absolutely nothing in it to reduce the cost of care. All it does is give big tax cuts to rich people and make poor people pay for them. I hope you tell your senators your ideas, and let them know that you are a Republican who voted for Trump.

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:46 pm

silvermani wrote:Just import H1B visa medical and nursing professionals by the truckloads and crash the cost of providing medical care. Have someone develop "sharing economy" type of app for the medical field also - let hospitals bid with the lowest estimate to perform surgeries. Give tax breaks to medical establishments that provide quality care at lower cost. That should help solve the problem. Right now hospitals and doctors can charge whatever exorbitant amount they want and that needs to stop.

One important reason costs are high is because people who choose not to or cannot afford to purchase health insurance and who are afflicted with serious health issues show up at emergency rooms. The cost of their treatment gets passed on to those with insurance. Importing H1Bs and tax breaks aren't going to change that basic structural issue.

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:55 pm

Give the senate bill a chance:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/wp/2017/06/23/give-the-senate-health-care-bill-a-chance-it-gives-vital-succor-to-so-many/?

by Idéfix Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:30 pm

That is funny.

People who called the House bill “mean” do not recognize that the meanest thing of all would be denying people Nice... “Succor” is what “aid” becomes once it passes into the correct income brackets.

The sad thing is that a lot of GOP supporters actually believe some of this nonsense. Like: "The Affordable Care Act placed a great burden on a great many people, and the Senate bill seeks to relieve their sacrifice."

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:57 am

by Idéfix Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:27 pm

by Idéfix Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:49 pm

by MaxEntropy_Man Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:45 pm

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2017/politics/senate-healthcare-subsidies/?

A lot of 50-60 year olds are going to pay a lot more than what they were paying. Which is fine because that's what they voted for.

by MaxEntropy_Man Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:36 am

Awww, the Cocks are unhappy with this bill:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/06/24/koch-network-withholding-support-of-senate-health-care-bill-pushing-for-changes/?

You can't fault me for wishing nature takes its course on these pus-filled gangrenes who have so much influence on our politics. So many lives would be saved if nature took its course with these two.

by MaxEntropy_Man Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:58 pm

CBO says 22 million will either lose insurance or choose not to insure themselves because of too high a cost:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/imminent-cbo-report-could-prove-pivotal-for-senate-republicans-health-care-bill/2017/06/26/cb8d61e2-59f7-11e7-a9f6-7c3296387341_story.html?

Marginally better than the House plan I think which was 23 million more than Obamacare.

by MaxEntropy_Man Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:08 pm

If they don't vote on it by the recess, the blow back they are going to get from constituents during the recess is going to be epic.

by MaxEntropy_Man Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:14 pm

This comment on WaPo nails it:

Health care is not a right. Neither is not being on fire, but we decided it would be cool if we all pooled our money to have fire departments that help people with that.

by Idéfix Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:29 pm

Where are all the trumptards with empathy oozing out of their pores for struggling families? More than 20 million people lose healthcare. Why?

So these guys can feel better ideologically? Are their ideological beliefs more valuable than the lives of thousands that will end prematurely each year due to loss of healthcare?

So billionaires can get their multi-million dollar tax cuts? Why is giving that tax cut to a billionaire more important to society than continuing coverage for a few thousand people with that same money?

by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:37 pm

Turtle beats a tactical retreat. I still fully expect them to extract their tax breaks for the 0.1% at the expense of their base losing health insurance.

by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:49 pm

Idéfix wrote:Where are all the trumptards with empathy oozing out of their pores for struggling families? More than 20 million people lose healthcare. Why?

So these guys can feel better ideologically? Are their ideological beliefs more valuable than the lives of thousands that will end prematurely each year due to loss of healthcare?

So billionaires can get their multi-million dollar tax cuts? Why is giving that tax cut to a billionaire more important to society than continuing coverage for a few thousand people with that same money?

Because everything that the working class people earn has to be consecrated by passing through the billionaires' urinary tract.

by silvermani Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:07 pm

Idéfix wrote:Where are all the trumptards with empathy oozing out of their pores for struggling families? More than 20 million people lose healthcare. Why?

So these guys can feel better ideologically? Are their ideological beliefs more valuable than the lives of thousands that will end prematurely each year due to loss of healthcare?

So billionaires can get their multi-million dollar tax cuts? Why is giving that tax cut to a billionaire more important to society than continuing coverage for a few thousand people with that same money?

Faux outrage alert!

by Idéfix Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:18 pm

silvermani wrote:
Idéfix wrote:Where are all the trumptards with empathy oozing out of their pores for struggling families? More than 20 million people lose healthcare. Why?

So these guys can feel better ideologically? Are their ideological beliefs more valuable than the lives of thousands that will end prematurely each year due to loss of healthcare?

So billionaires can get their multi-million dollar tax cuts? Why is giving that tax cut to a billionaire more important to society than continuing coverage for a few thousand people with that same money?
Faux outrage alert!

I will get a sizable tax cut if this bill passes. But I think kicking 22 million people to the curb is bad policy.

As someone who oozes empathy for working class Americans who can't make ends meet, what is your stance on the Senate bill?

by Idéfix Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:54 pm

Over twenty thousand people will die every year as a result of this bill.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/jun/26/bernie-s/bernie-sanders-projection-thousands-added-deaths-g/

The first time in history that a democratically elected government passes a bill that has a death toll among its own citizenry. History being made in front of our eyes.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:33 pm

GOP's tactics backfiring:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2017/07/05/a-gop-stunt-backfires-and-accidentally-reveals-a-truth-republicans-want-hidden/?

With the Republican campaign to repeal and replace the Affordable Care Act now set to enter its final, frenzied push, the Indianapolis Star reports that the Indiana GOP attempted a stunt that was supposed to provide Republicans with more ammunition against the law. But the stunt went awry:

The Indiana Republican Party posed a question to Facebook on Monday: “What’s your Obamacare horror story? Let us know.”

The responses were unexpected.

“My sister finally has access to affordable quality care and treatment for her diabetes.”

“My father’s small business was able to insure its employees for the first time ever. #thanksObama”

“Love Obamacare!”

“The only horror in the story is that Republicans might take it away.”…

By 8:30 a.m. Tuesday, the Indiana GOP’s post collected more than 1,500 comments, the vast majority in support of Obamacare.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:47 pm

I have a plan that the GOP will be happy with. Repeal the ACA, i.e. do a pure repeal just like the goobers want. While repealing don't talk about the replacement. Then using your mouse copy the entire contents of the ACA and paste into a different document and title it McConell-Trump Care plan and vote on it. It will have everything the people want and the black man's name gone from any reference to healthcare. Everyone will be happy and problem solved. Leper will even sign it because it is not Obamacare which we know is failing.

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jul 06, 2017 7:48 pm

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:33 pm

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/mcconnell-says-gop-must-shore-up-aca-insurance-markets-if-senate-bill-dies/2017/07/06/e2df2b8e-6251-11e7-8adc-fea80e32bf47_story.html?

Our-top-political-priority-over-the-next-two-years-is-to-deny-President-Obama-a-second-term-Mitchell-McConnell wants to shore up Obamacare?

The horror!

We the democratic base can crow about this, but it is best that Democratic politicians show some grace about this and sound enthusiastic about working with McTurtle.

by Hellsangel Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:40 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/mcconnell-says-gop-must-shore-up-aca-insurance-markets-if-senate-bill-dies/2017/07/06/e2df2b8e-6251-11e7-8adc-fea80e32bf47_story.html?

Our-top-political-priority-over-the-next-two-years-is-to-deny-President-Obama-a-second-term-Mitchell-McConnell wants to shore up Obamacare?

The horror!

We the democratic base can crow about this, but it is best that Democratic politicians show some grace about this and sound enthusiastic about working with McTurtle.

After eating crow, maybe the DemocRAT base needs a new tv show like The West Wing to console them.

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:45 pm

OTOH I don't trust wily McTurtle. This may be a hail Mary pass to get his caucus in lock step with the threat of collaborating with dems.

by confuzzled dude Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:59 pm

The GOP then took a shot at Hillary Clinton, the vanquished 2016 presidential contender.

“We’ve got to fix what’s broken.” Where's your plan, @HillaryClinton? pic.twitter.com/CmRB4mCsZd

— GOP (@GOP) July 5, 2017

Hours later, Clinton fired back, tweeting a link to her campaign website, on which she outlined a plan to expand the Affordable Care Act and reduce out-of-pocket health-care and prescription drug costs, among other things.

Right here. Includes radical provisions like how not to kick 23 mil ppl off their coverage. Feel free to run w/it.https://t.co/jBMFBJpSP7 https://t.co/zZoA16Ym03

— Hillary Clinton (@HillaryClinton) July 5, 2017

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/07/06/the-gop-tried-to-troll-hillary-clinton-it-backfired-spectacularly/?hpid=hp_rhp-top-table-main_hillaryclinton-1240pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.df9d61b30081#comments

So, they are looking all over for a plan that works!

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:35 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
The GOP then took a shot at Hillary Clinton, the vanquished 2016 presidential contender.

“We’ve got to fix what’s broken.” Where's your plan, @HillaryClinton? pic.twitter.com/CmRB4mCsZd

— GOP (@GOP) July 5, 2017

Hours later, Clinton fired back, tweeting a link to her campaign website, on which she outlined a plan to expand the Affordable Care Act and reduce out-of-pocket health-care and prescription drug costs, among other things.

Right here. Includes radical provisions like how not to kick 23 mil ppl off their coverage. Feel free to run w/it.https://t.co/jBMFBJpSP7 https://t.co/zZoA16Ym03

— Hillary Clinton (@HillaryClinton) July 5, 2017
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/07/06/the-gop-tried-to-troll-hillary-clinton-it-backfired-spectacularly/?hpid=hp_rhp-top-table-main_hillaryclinton-1240pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.df9d61b30081#comments

So, they are looking all over for a plan that works!

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Jul 06, 2017 11:44 pm

Very clear opinion column by Catherine Rampell on why the amendment Ted Cruz is proposing is doomed to failure:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-reason-republican-health-care-plans-are-doomed-to-fail/2017/07/06/4bb40f92-6286-11e7-a4f7-af34fc1d9d39_story.html?

Joseph Stiglitz and two others won the Econ Nobel prize for explaining this some years ago. I wish our local Econ expert would post on this topic. It is very much in his wheelhouse.

by MaxEntropy_Man Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:14 am

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/a-town-hall-in-kansas-shows-republican-struggles-with-health-care-bill/2017/07/06/93a0a79e-6267-11e7-8adc-fea80e32bf47_story.html?

by Idéfix Tue Jul 11, 2017 4:45 pm

A simple chart showing the financial implications of the Senate bill.

Proposed changes to ACA in the Senate bill Senate-healthcare-bill-poor-chart

Proposed changes to ACA in the Senate bill Senate-healthcare-bill-poor-chart

Source: http://time.com/money/4853456/senate-healthcare-bill-winners-losers/

Most of Trump's base will get screwed by this bill.

by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Jul 11, 2017 5:53 pm

Some of Trump's base will get screwed by this. Trump voters are on average richer than Hillary voters.

by Idéfix Tue Jul 11, 2017 6:12 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:Some of Trump's base will get screwed by this. Trump voters are on average richer than Hillary voters.

Because of the way income is distributed across the population, the majority of Trump voters are people who make $75k or less. About 80% of American households make less than $110k a year. So even as Trump voters overall were richer than Clinton voters, the majority of people who elected him will lose from this policy.

Here's a useful way of looking at the voting choices by where people fall in the income distribution.
Proposed changes to ACA in the Senate bill Unnamed-1024x796

Proposed changes to ACA in the Senate bill Unnamed-1024x796

Trump won a majority of people in the bottom two-thirds of the income distribution, while Clinton got a majority of the vote in the top-third (and a decisive majority in the top 5%).

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