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Diggy Raja slaps BJP workers trying to intimidate him

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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 8:37 pm

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Digvijaya-loses-it-slaps-BJP-workers/H1-Article1-722412.aspx#disqus_thread

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun Jul 17, 2011 8:54 pm

Rashmunullah and Maulana Merlot applaud Divijay ji's action.

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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 8:55 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:Rashmunullah and Maulana Merlot applaud Divijay ji's action.

Uppiliullah gets scared and goes berserk.

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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:05 pm

Forget about Uppili. What do you think of Digvijay's beating up of political opponents?
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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:13 pm

charvaka wrote:Forget about Uppili. What do you think of Digvijay's beating up of political opponents?

i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.

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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:17 pm

Rashmun wrote:To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Should we all applaud "Diggy Raja" for his courage and strength? Let me know so I can do the needful.
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Post by Hellsangel Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:18 pm

[quote="Rashmun"]
charvaka wrote:
i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Couldn't he have just challenged the trouble maker to a duel?
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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:22 pm

Hellsangel wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Couldn't he have just challenged the trouble maker to a duel?
lol!
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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:34 pm

[quote="Hellsangel"]
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Couldn't he have just challenged the trouble maker to a duel?

--> the problem was that there were many trouble makers. So Diggy decided to thrash them rather than have a duel with each of them one by one.

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:38 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Forget about Uppili. What do you think of Digvijay's beating up of political opponents?

i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.

What do you think of Diggy ji's accusing comments on the RSS, and hindus over the last 10 years? Or, you think that (only) Diggy ji, being a Raja, has rights to say whatever he wants.

Your statement resembles how you justify your abusing women, mothers and wives of CH saying others abused you first by questioning your views.

Please come to our Vibhuti Jagran next Friday.

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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:39 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Should we all applaud "Diggy Raja" for his courage and strength? Let me know so I can do the needful.

--> isn't it surprising that a middle aged man like Diggy Raja managed to thrash youth bjp workers? it appears that after heckling and abusing Diggy, these bjp workers allowed themselves to be thrashed willingly.

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Post by sambarvada Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:41 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Forget about Uppili. What do you think of Digvijay's beating up of political opponents?

i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.


====> Even George Bush did not lose his temper when a shoe was thrown at him.

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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:52 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.
Should we all applaud "Diggy Raja" for his courage and strength? Let me know so I can do the needful.

--> isn't it surprising that a middle aged man like Diggy Raja managed to thrash youth bjp workers? it appears that after heckling and abusing Diggy, these bjp workers allowed themselves to be thrashed willingly.
Congrats Diggy Raja! Congrats Rashmun! Congrats Sonia.
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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:53 pm

sambarvada wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Forget about Uppili. What do you think of Digvijay's beating up of political opponents?

i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses? I recently heard a BJP spokesperson claiming that OBL's aatma has entered into Digvijay Singh's body and that this aatma needs to be exorcised. You will agree that this is hitting below the belt.

To conclude, from what i have been able to make out so far, Diggy losing his temper after being ridiculed and heckled by BJP workers is something like Zidane losing his temper in the World cup finals.


====> Even George Bush did not lose his temper when a shoe was thrown at him.

--> the point is that how did the bjp workers heckle Diggy Raja? We don't really know so it would be unwise to pass any judgement on Diggy before the full facts are before us.

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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:00 pm

Rashmun wrote:--> the point is that how did the bjp workers heckle Diggy Raja? We don't really know so it would be unwise to pass any judgement on Diggy before the full facts are before us.
The word "heckle" does not indicate physical violence. If Diggy Raja beats up people who verbally insult him, then he is nothing more than a goonda. You should "disapprove of" his actions, if you truly disapprove of physical violence; otherwise your claim that you "disapprove of physical violence" is hypocritical.
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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:05 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:--> the point is that how did the bjp workers heckle Diggy Raja? We don't really know so it would be unwise to pass any judgement on Diggy before the full facts are before us.
The word "heckle" does not indicate physical violence. If Diggy Raja beats up people who verbally insult him, then he is nothing more than a goonda. You should "disapprove of" his actions, if you truly disapprove of physical violence; otherwise your claim that you "disapprove of physical violence" is hypocritical.

--> you are giving your own spin on the word 'heckle'. For all we know these bjp workers tugged at his shirt and pulled his hair or threw some cake at his face. If this--or something similar-- is the case Diggy would have been justified in slapping them.

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Post by Hellsangel Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:05 pm

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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:09 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:--> the point is that how did the bjp workers heckle Diggy Raja? We don't really know so it would be unwise to pass any judgement on Diggy before the full facts are before us.
The word "heckle" does not indicate physical violence. If Diggy Raja beats up people who verbally insult him, then he is nothing more than a goonda. You should "disapprove of" his actions, if you truly disapprove of physical violence; otherwise your claim that you "disapprove of physical violence" is hypocritical.

--> you are giving your own spin on the word 'heckle'. For all we know these bjp workers tugged at his shirt and pulled his hair or threw some cake at his face. If this--or something similar-- is the case Diggy would have been justified in slapping them.

--> also, the incident happened in madhya pradesh where the bjp is in power. a case was registered regarding this incident but Diggy's name does not figure in the case. So why is the BJP running scared of Diggy? If the man has done something wrong, BJP--being in power in M.P.--should have booked him for indulging in physical violence.

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Post by charvaka Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:09 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:The word "heckle" does not indicate physical violence.
--> you are giving your own spin on the word 'heckle'.
From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:
heck·le

verb \ˈhe-kəl\
heck·ledheck·ling


Definition of HECKLE


transitive verb
: to harass and try to disconcert with questions, challenges, or gibes : badger

heck·ler noun



http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/heckle?show=0&t=1310958449
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Post by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:11 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:The word "heckle" does not indicate physical violence.
--> you are giving your own spin on the word 'heckle'.
From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:
heck·le

verb \ˈhe-kəl\
heck·ledheck·ling


Definition of HECKLE


transitive verb
: to harass and try to disconcert with questions, challenges, or gibes : badger

heck·ler noun



http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/heckle?show=0&t=1310958449

----

are you responding to my other post? The incident took place in Madhya Pradesh where the BJP is in power. So if Diggy did something wrong then whey did the BJP not book him for physically thrashing BJP workers.

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Post by charvaka Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:07 am

Rashmun wrote:So if Diggy did something wrong then whey did the BJP not book him for physically thrashing BJP workers.
Perhaps because the BJP government leaders have no respect for the law themselves, so they fail to see the problem here, like you.
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Post by Another Brick Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:22 am

Rashmun wrote:
i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses?

no matter what the BJP workers did, he had no right to thrash them. you are letting your hatred for the BJP cloud your judgement by raising concerns over "heckling". don't you think reporters would have reported it if it wasn't just heckling? after all, by your logic, the congress is in power in delhi and must be controlling national dailies? what stopped them from spinning a story like that?

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Post by Merlot Daruwala Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:26 am

Digvijaya Singh seems to have gone totally out of control now. In addition to shooting off his mouth he's now into letting his fists do the talking.
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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:13 am

Another Brick wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
i disapprove of physical violence. on the other hand, i am sure the BJP youth wing must have baited and abused him deliberately and purposely so as to inflame him. The news report says that the BJP workers waved black flags and 'heckled him'. One would like to know how they heckled him--did they shower him with filthy abuses?

no matter what the BJP workers did, he had no right to thrash them. you are letting your hatred for the BJP cloud your judgement by raising concerns over "heckling". don't you think reporters would have reported it if it wasn't just heckling? after all, by your logic, the congress is in power in delhi and must be controlling national dailies? what stopped them from spinning a story like that?

--> what if, as per the congress version, the bjp workers attacked his car with sticks, and also pelted stones at him? Would it be acceptable for Diggy to slap a person throwing stones at him?

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/digvijaya-singh-slapped-me-says-bjp-worker-120201?topfive

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Post by Another Brick Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:06 am

Rashmun wrote:
--> what if, as per the congress version, the bjp workers attacked his car with sticks, and also pelted stones at him? Would it be acceptable for Diggy to slap a person throwing stones at him?

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/digvijaya-singh-slapped-me-says-bjp-worker-120201?topfive

then he is even more foolish than i thought because you don't mess with an angry mob which is already pelting stones at you. in any case, one would expect a senior politician to lodge a police complaint than to take the law in his own hands. what is he, sunny deol?

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Post by Propagandhi711 Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:22 am

what I wanna know is did he have to take off the elbow length gloves before slapping him? a duel with one hand tied behind is much better.

I hope someone congratulated pig-dickvijay singh and sania.

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:55 am

Another Brick wrote: what is he, sunny deolRajni?

**Amended**

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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:12 pm

Another Brick wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
--> what if, as per the congress version, the bjp workers attacked his car with sticks, and also pelted stones at him? Would it be acceptable for Diggy to slap a person throwing stones at him?

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/digvijaya-singh-slapped-me-says-bjp-worker-120201?topfive

then he is even more foolish than i thought because you don't mess with an angry mob which is already pelting stones at you. in any case, one would expect a senior politician to lodge a police complaint than to take the law in his own hands. what is he, sunny deol?

--> but he seems to have gotten away with it. also, the congress is creating a scene in the madhya pradesh assembly at how a former chief minister of M.P. was ambushed by BJP workers. it appears that the congress would not have been so belligerent if Diggy was to blame.

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Post by charvaka Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:14 pm

Rashmun wrote:it appears that the congress would not have been so belligerent if Diggy was to blame.
Excellent logic.
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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:18 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:So if Diggy did something wrong then whey did the BJP not book him for physically thrashing BJP workers.
Perhaps because the BJP government leaders have no respect for the law themselves, so they fail to see the problem here, like you.

even mayawati would not tolerate BSP workers being beaten up by a leader of some other party. the likely explanation is that the bjp workers are to blame and diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.

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Post by charvaka Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:19 pm

Rashmun wrote:diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.
In other words, you are accusing Diggy of taking the law into his own hands. Do you support people carrying out their own violent punishments against offenders? Or is it a privilege you accord only to Diggy?
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Post by Propagandhi711 Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:26 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:it appears that the congress would not have been so belligerent if Diggy was to blame.
Excellent logic.


hey I was gonna LOL at this first. someone walked into my office and this was already LOLed at by the time I got back to posting.

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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:53 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.
In other words, you are accusing Diggy of taking the law into his own hands. Do you support people carrying out their own violent punishments against offenders? Or is it a privilege you accord only to Diggy?

--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?

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Post by Hellsangel Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:47 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.
In other words, you are accusing Diggy of taking the law into his own hands. Do you support people carrying out their own violent punishments against offenders? Or is it a privilege you accord only to Diggy?

--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
What if said threat was carried out with a kukri?
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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 4:12 pm

Hellsangel wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.
In other words, you are accusing Diggy of taking the law into his own hands. Do you support people carrying out their own violent punishments against offenders? Or is it a privilege you accord only to Diggy?

--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
What if said threat was carried out with a kukri?


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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 4:54 pm

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.
In other words, you are accusing Diggy of taking the law into his own hands. Do you support people carrying out their own violent punishments against offenders? Or is it a privilege you accord only to Diggy?

--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?

Yes, if you are otherwise defenseless and alone.

But if you are a political figure and in public, there are so many other things that you can do. Like make the case against the barbaric bjp workers. Once you slap around, then you become one of them. They were in a group, they won't be named individually. No one knows them, they have nothing to lose. But you have a lot to lose.

Diggy slapped him not coz he feared safety, but coz he lost his temper. Like Mahatma Gandhi has said, 'never lose temper in public, you lose respect instantly'.

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Post by charvaka Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:23 pm

Rashmun wrote:--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
I will challenge him to a duel. Will you be my second?
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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:29 pm

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
I will challenge him to a duel. Will you be my second?

--> at ease, General Charvaka.

--Field Marshal Rashmun

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Post by artood2 Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:45 pm

digv was once slapped by supporters of VC Shukla when he did not let him become the CM of newly created Chattisgarh (he was a CM then!). Guess he understood the first strike principle. he is the LiLo of Indian politics, always in news for the wrong reasons
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Post by Hellsangel Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:59 pm

Rashmun wrote:

--Field Marshal Rashmun
You and what army?
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Post by Propagandhi711 Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:05 pm

he's prince nauda, grand field marshal of the golden army

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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:37 pm

Propagandhi711 wrote:he's prince nauda, grand field marshal of the golden army

--> and are you a corporal in the said army?

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Post by Propagandhi711 Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:21 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:he's prince nauda, grand field marshal of the golden army

--> and are you a corporal in the said army?

I'm hellboy or atleast johann krauss

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Post by Guest Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:31 pm

Propagandhi711 wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Propagandhi711 wrote:he's prince nauda, grand field marshal of the golden army

--> and are you a corporal in the said army?

I'm hellboy or atleast johann krauss

--> are you sure you want to be krauss?

------

Because Kraus is made of ectoplasm
and has no solid body, he requires neither sleep nor food. However, the
extreme sensitivity of his powers makes him vulnerable to psychic
attack. His ectoplasm can be taken over by stronger spirits, who are
then made corporeal. This can be either dangerous or helpful, depending
on the spirit's nature.

The only protection Johann has from dissipation is his B.P.R.D.-built
containment suit; once the suit is breached, he must find a new
container for his essence or he will cease to exist.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Kraus

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Post by charvaka Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:04 am

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
I will challenge him to a duel. Will you be my second?

--> at ease, General Charvaka.

--Field Marshal Rashmun
I take it you are not going to respond to TW's questions.
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Post by Another Brick Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:36 am

Rashmun wrote:even mayawati would not tolerate BSP workers being beaten up by a leader of some other party. the likely explanation is that the bjp workers are to blame and diggy was only indulging in some kind of tit for tat behavior.

and you justify that? would you also justify godhra because it was also tit for tat and reaction to action according to some? do you realize that you are digging yourself a deep hole here?

a smart politician would have perhaps cashed in this opportunity to take whatever political mileage out of this incident. but the idiot that pigvijay singh is, he lost it completely and made a fool of himself. and you are justifying that action blindly only because a congressi did that.

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Post by SomeProfile Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:48 am

Another Brick wrote:do you realize that you are digging yourself a deep hole here?

Nope. Rashmun will never realize that (or any fallacy in his 'logic') because it was never published in any book or article he consults.

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Post by Guest Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:36 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:--> if someone throws stones at you or threatens you with a knife, would you not bitchslap him if you are able to?
I will challenge him to a duel. Will you be my second?

--> at ease, General Charvaka.

--Field Marshal Rashmun
I take it you are not going to respond to TW's questions.

--> TW gave her own perspective on this issue. She never asked me any questions.

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Post by charvaka Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:14 am

Rashmun wrote:TW gave her own perspective on this issue. She never asked me any questions.
Right, and that's a good reason to not respond to her. You can even apply the Rashmun Method and start saying things like "if TW had not not wanted a response, she would not have not asked a question." Both TW and AB have made good points regarding the issue we are talking about; points that demolish your arguments.

Rashmun wrote:Rashmun will never realize that (or any fallacy in his 'logic') because
it was never published in any book or article he consults.
If you show him evidence from a book that the Rashmun Method leads to fallacies, he will ignore it. The key principle of the Rashmun Method is: if any argument leads to the conclusion makes the Congress look bad in comparison to the BJP, then that argument should be ignored in a closeminded manner, logic be damned. It is similar to the Sevan Method: if any logic / argument leads to Hinduism look bad in comparison to other religions, then that argument should be ignored in a closeminded manner, logic be damned.
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Post by Guest Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:47 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:TW gave her own perspective on this issue. She never asked me any questions.
Right, and that's a good reason to not respond to her. You can even apply the Rashmun Method and start saying things like "if TW had not not wanted a response, she would not have not asked a question." Both TW and AB have made good points regarding the issue we are talking about; points that demolish your arguments.

Rashmun wrote:Rashmun will never realize that (or any fallacy in his 'logic') because
it was never published in any book or article he consults.
If you show him evidence from a book that the Rashmun Method leads to fallacies, he will ignore it. The key principle of the Rashmun Method is: if any argument leads to the conclusion makes the Congress look bad in comparison to the BJP, then that argument should be ignored in a closeminded manner, logic be damned. It is similar to the Sevan Method: if any logic / argument leads to Hinduism look bad in comparison to other religions, then that argument should be ignored in a closeminded manner, logic be damned.

--> have fun Carvaka.

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