why i dislike drumpf so much

First, I argued that the possible election of “Demagogue Donald” dwarfs congressional dysfunction as a threat to American prosperity. Beyond lunatic and incoherent budget and trade policies, Donald Trump would for the first time make political risk of the kind usually discussed in the context of Argentina, China or Russia relevant to the United States. How else to interpret threats to renegotiate debt, prosecute insubordinate publications and rip up treaties? Creeping fascism as an issue dwarfs macroeconomic policy!

confuzzled dude wrote:

First, I argued that the possible election of “Demagogue Donald” dwarfs congressional dysfunction as a threat to American prosperity. Beyond lunatic and incoherent budget and trade policies, Donald Trump would for the first time make political risk of the kind usually discussed in the context of Argentina, China or Russia relevant to the United States. How else to interpret threats to renegotiate debt, prosecute insubordinate publications and rip up treaties? Creeping fascism as an issue dwarfs macroeconomic policy!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/05/24/larry-summers-what-you-need-to-know-about-the-next-recession-starring-donald-trump/?hpid=hp_regional-hp-cards_rhp-card-business%3Ahomepage%2Fcard

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

southindian wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

What is there in Donald Trump to like? That can be a very short list.

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
He has raised very loving, caring and responsible kids. Look at them -- almost all of them, especially the eldest daughter, taking a huge  and ery active role in his presidential campaign. He is a role model for all the fathers.

southindian wrote:

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
He has raised very loving, caring and responsible kids. Look at them -- almost all of them, especially the eldest daughter, taking a huge  and ery active role in his presidential campaign. He is a role model for all the fathers.

Oh! So he's a normal father. What's new in that? This is not exceptional.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me.
** oh sure, max. you're a secular elite and any kind of hating you do must be of the good, acceptable kind.

of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that.

** trump has actually displayed an extraordinary curiousness and intelligence about the people most unlike him: the left-behinds. he understand what makes them tick, he knows what's worrying them and he's willing to talk to them without amazingly not really addressing any of it. he's like oprah for white men.

**are the democrats talking to the left-behinds at all? and when they do, is it in simple language that they understand? of course the secular-elite you are, you will call them too stupid instead of working on the more interesting task of delivering complex info in a simple way. actually the democrats have no interest in them. these democrats deserve the sleepless nights that trump is giving them.  this reminds me of the time when modi, yes, babe, that other "outlier" won: congress was apparently focused only on figuring out the winning strategy with zero ideas for the nation, whereas modi went on to connect with people.

this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much,

** being the POTUS is not rocket science. the left-behinds understand this, that's why they don't give a shit about hillary and her brains and her experience. give it a rest with the intelligence. the man is winning. what part of it do you not get?

and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons.

** i feel very bad for hillary clinton, she was always presidential material, probably even 10 yrs before her husband became the president. i'm afraid she's going to kill herself if she doesn't win. i would avoid keeping sharp items around her.

i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

** the gop wants a winner. and they all love trump and his ideas, they're only upset he's actually saying it on camera.

pravalika nanda wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me.

** oh sure, max. you're a secular elite and any kind of hating you do must be of the good, acceptable kind.

pravalika nanda wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that.

** trump has actually displayed an extraordinary curiousness and intelligence about the people most unlike him: the left-behinds. he understand what makes them tick, he knows what's worrying them and he's willing to talk to them without amazingly not really addressing any of it. he's like oprah for white men.

pravalika nanda wrote:**are the democrats talking to the left-behinds at all? and when they do, is it in simple language that they understand? of course the secular-elite you are, you will call them too stupid instead of working on the more interesting task of delivering complex info in a simple way. actually the democrats have no interest in them. these democrats deserve the sleepless nights that trump is giving them.  this reminds me of the time when modi, yes, babe, that other "outlier" won: congress was apparently focused only on figuring out the winning strategy with zero ideas for the nation, whereas modi went on to connect with people.

pravalika nanda wrote:** being the POTUS is not rocket science. the left-behinds understand this, that's why they don't give a shit about hillary and her brains and her experience. give it a rest with the intelligence. the man is winning. what part of it do you not get?

pravalika nanda wrote:** the gop wants a winner. and they all love trump and his ideas, they're only upset he's actually saying it on camera.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

swapna wrote:I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

swapna wrote:I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

i didn't say that he was indifferent. the relationship between incuriousness and indifference is something you conjured up.

>> "indifferent" is a synonym of "incurious."

swapna wrote:I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

really? what changed from from a few years ago?

>> the year. it was 2012 then, it's 2016 now; and there are more interesting candidates now. I still think that hilary clinton is the most qualified candidate.

just a few days ago you were praising thanking (sorry i keep forgetting)...

>> it's not forgetfulness that makes you prevaricate.

..drumpf for his courage and audacity.

>> yes  I was, and you can barely contain ypur anger! I don't feel the."visceral hatred" towards trump that you confessed to feeling. I suppose, you and I have different stakes in this election. moreover, trump doesn't embarrass me like he does you, because I have limited expectations of americans and poltiticians.

you seem to be about as consistent in your beliefs as drumpf!

>> you're confusing consistency with constancy.

swapna wrote:I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

i'll try doing that. meanwhile, please also learn to live with the deficiencies of your country without complaining too much about some of its citizens, the third world dump and cesspool of intolerance that it is.

>> don't worry about us; we're repairing the mess you left behind. 

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

i didn't say that he was indifferent. the relationship between incuriousness and indifference is something you conjured up.

swapna wrote:I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

really? what changed from from a few years ago? just a few days ago you were praising thanking (sorry i keep forgetting) drumpf for his courage and audacity.  you seem to be about as consistent in your beliefs as drumpf!

swapna wrote:I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

i'll try doing that. meanwhile, please also learn to live with the deficiencies of your country without complaining too much about some of its citizens, the third world dump and cesspool of intolerance that it is.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:and swapna, since you are not eligible to vote in the american elections, your reaction is not exactly relevant, illaya?

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

i didn't say that he was indifferent. the relationship between incuriousness and indifference is something you conjured up.

swapna wrote:I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

really? what changed from from a few years ago? just a few days ago you were praising thanking (sorry i keep forgetting) drumpf for his courage and audacity.  you seem to be about as consistent in your beliefs as drumpf!

swapna wrote:I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

i'll try doing that. meanwhile, please also learn to live with the deficiencies of your country without complaining too much about some of its citizens, the third world dump and cesspool of intolerance that it is.

when you asked "what changed from a few years ago" above, you linked a thread from 2012, in which you had insisted on placing the blame for cia director petraeus's extramarital affair(s) squarely on his wife, for not maintaining her body. it was revealing to read that thread again. thank you.

swapna wrote:

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

swapna wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me. of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that. this lack of intelligence is also why i dislike dubya so much, and to a certain extent that patron saint of the GoP. daddy bush ranks much higher in my estimation as does mr. 47%. i even like nixon better than dubya and of course drumpf. another person i really can't stand is rick perry but the saving grace is that he isn't a demagogue.

it is also why despite all the shenanigans, i can tolerate the clintons. i am sure there are good examples of dumb democratic pols, but the GoP just seems loaded with them. that they've let drumpf commandeer their party is proof positive of that.

if trump were incurious, he would be indifferent, unconcerned, and  aloof. he is anything but indifferent.

i didn't say that he was indifferent. the relationship between incuriousness and indifference is something you conjured up.

swapna wrote:I do not support trump or anyone else for the presidency. in particular, I don't support his views on immigration.

really? what changed from from a few years ago? just a few days ago you were praising thanking (sorry i keep forgetting) drumpf for his courage and audacity.  you seem to be about as consistent in your beliefs as drumpf!

swapna wrote:I suspect that your "visceral hatred" of trump is due to your perception that he is not knowledgeable enough, not erudite, and has no style. that's not only trump; that's your country. the u.s.a.! learn to live with those deficiencies.

i'll try doing that. meanwhile, please also learn to live with the deficiencies of your country without complaining too much about some of its citizens, the third world dump and cesspool of intolerance that it is.

when you asked "what changed from a few years ago" above, you linked a thread from 2012, in which you had insisted on placing the blame for cia director petraeus's extramarital affair(s) squarely on his wife, for not maintaining her body. it was revealing to read that thread again. thank you.

let me amend what I wrote above, in particular, delete the word "squarely." what you wrote was: "finally, and I feel terrible for saying this, the wives of these generals must carry a little blame for letting themselves go like this."

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

pravalika nanda wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:i've been thinking about what it is about drumpf that engenders such a visceral hatred in me.

** oh sure, max. you're a secular elite and any kind of hating you do must be of the good, acceptable kind.

i'll ignore the vacuous attack. btw, what does being secular have to do with criticizing drumpf?

pravalika nanda wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:of all the negative characteristics that a politician could have, particularly a presidential candidate, incuriousness and a general lack of intelligence ranks very high with me. drumpf has spadefuls of that, and he layers virulent demagoguery on top of that.

** trump has actually displayed an extraordinary curiousness and intelligence about the people most unlike him: the left-behinds. he understand what makes them tick, he knows what's worrying them and he's willing to talk to them without amazingly not really addressing any of it. he's like oprah for white men.

the bolded part is true! but i'd insert an "angry" before "white men".

pravalika nanda wrote:**are the democrats talking to the left-behinds at all? and when they do, is it in simple language that they understand? of course the secular-elite you are, you will call them too stupid instead of working on the more interesting task of delivering complex info in a simple way. actually the democrats have no interest in them. these democrats deserve the sleepless nights that trump is giving them.  this reminds me of the time when modi, yes, babe, that other "outlier" won: congress was apparently focused only on figuring out the winning strategy with zero ideas for the nation, whereas modi went on to connect with people.

democrats have been the only people who have cared about the working class -- issues like health care, minimum wage etc. are quintessentially democratic issues. we have social security and medicaid because of the work of democratic politicians of yore.

pravalika nanda wrote:** being the POTUS is not rocket science. the left-behinds understand this, that's why they don't give a shit about hillary and her brains and her experience. give it a rest with the intelligence. the man is winning. what part of it do you not get?

giving intelligence a rest is precisely what got us dubya, and the quagmire in iraq and afghanistan.

pravalika nanda wrote:** the gop wants a winner. and they all love trump and his ideas, they're only upset he's actually saying it on camera.

you must be living in a cave if you think the GOP loves drumpf. he says things that are anathema to what the GoP has traditionally stood for, in particular, free trade.

** you really believe this garbage that the republicans are against trump? yes, it would have been easier if it was jeb bush cuz then it would just be the old boys' club and with trump he may be a little difficult to control but he's saying everything that every republican has been saying behind closed doors for several decades. and it's something that even your somewhat-tamil, sometimes-buddy, flim flam has told you: this is a christian country, this country is great because of christians, consider yourself fortunate for being given the opportunity to live and work here. and if you don't like it, go back to india.

** also this whole thing about ryan not supporting him is the biggest longest deceptive soap opera i have ever watched in my entire life: that guy is so with trump. he will come around and support trump but will make sure he is the last one to actually come out and say so. cuz ryan is young and one day wants to be the POTUS. one day he will need that spanish vote. he doesn't want to jump in and throw his weight behind someone who is so openly divisive. so cunning, that pretty face.

drumpf is a demagogic, misogynistic, populist who will say whatever he thinks the crowd wants to hear.
** yes, cuz that's the only way to win the republican votes. and now that he's got all of them in his pocket, expect him to change his tune to capture the inds and dems.

his policies are an inconsistent and confused morass of ideas which change from minute to minute.
** he doesn't know politics and he doesn't know policy. but what's that got to do with winning this race? other than the occasional nerdeswar rao like you from boston, no one cares, not even flamman.

i can see why he appeals to a certain type of person, but it always amuses me to see an educated white collar person justifying the appeal. it is interesting that he doesn't repulse you. are you sure your fondness for him is unrelated to your opinion of people who dislike him?

** ayyayyo, dekho boys, isko hum kehte hain "too-goodism." it's when a secular elite tries to show how good he is by trying to pretend the other person is really really too bad. these logon. for explaining trump's popularity to the head-in-the-sanders (ha ha ha ha!), i'm accused of being fond of him.

** for secular elites, you're no good unless you're too-good. to be too-good, you have to parrot all the things SEs say with exactly their passion. i don't know boys, my mom didn't teach me to parrot nobody. what did your mom teach you, boys?


drumpf is hardly a republican or a conservative. he could have run as the populist candidate of any party, but it is interesting that it is the republican party that he has commandeered.

** the republican party had not yet chosen their candidate, so it made sense he would run there. what is interesting is that the democratic party stymied all competition even before the competition began leaving us with hillary from start to finish and the old geezer sanders was more of a sideshow and nothing of substance came out of his run.  the dems are slow to realize that one has to be popular and well-liked to be the potus. it is unfortunate but true that in politics, it is not entirely about how capable one is, but if he/she appeals to the masses. and thanks to trump's openness and authenticity we are learning more about the american masses than we ever have.