This is supposed to be bad parenting?

by MulaiAzhagi Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:15 pm

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/norway-custody-row-mother-was-depressed-needed-help-with-children-says-report-177992

Father Anurup, a Geologist, got his share of blame from the court; the observations would make the average Indian father reassess his work-life balance. The court has objected to his "prioritising work" and for enrolling in a Norwegian language course and taking driving lessons instead of spending more time at home. Sagarika was "rigid", the court said, for not insisting that the husband stay more at home and help. It found Anurup "rigid" because he did not encourage the children's grandparents to come to Norway. It even found Aishwarya, then barely six months old, a "rigid and silent child."

The Bhatacharyas have, through their months of ordeal, said that "cultural misunderstandings" caused this tale of separation. The Norwegian authorities have categorically denied that cultural differences have played a role in their decision to take the children away. Yet, the court noted as part of its case against the parents that they had an arranged marriage; commonplace in India, not largely understood in the West.

And the court takes umbrage at Anurup Bhattacharya saying that going back to India is the solution for the beleaguered family.

===> What kind of upbringing did the Norwegian guy who killed 77 people have?

by Kris Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:11 pm

Father Anurup, a Geologist, got his share of blame from the court; the observations would make the average Indian father reassess his work-life balance. The court has objected to his "prioritising work" and for enrolling in a Norwegian language course and taking driving lessons instead of spending more time at home. Sagarika was "rigid", the court said, for not insisting that the husband stay more at home and help. It found Anurup "rigid" because he did not encourage the children's grandparents to come to Norway. It even found Aishwarya, then barely six months old, a "rigid and silent child."

The Bhatacharyas have, through their months of ordeal, said that "cultural misunderstandings" caused this tale of separation. The Norwegian authorities have categorically denied that cultural differences have played a role in their decision to take the children away.

>>>> The joys of nanny-statehood!

by Propagandhi711 Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:19 pm

Kris wrote:Father Anurup, a Geologist, got his share of blame from the court; the observations would make the average Indian father reassess his work-life balance. The court has objected to his "prioritising work" and for enrolling in a Norwegian language course and taking driving lessons instead of spending more time at home. Sagarika was "rigid", the court said, for not insisting that the husband stay more at home and help. It found Anurup "rigid" because he did not encourage the children's grandparents to come to Norway. It even found Aishwarya, then barely six months old, a "rigid and silent child."

The Bhatacharyas have, through their months of ordeal, said that "cultural misunderstandings" caused this tale of separation. The Norwegian authorities have categorically denied that cultural differences have played a role in their decision to take the children away.

>>>> The joys of nanny-statehood!

tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:22 pm

MulaiAzhagi wrote:http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/norway-custody-row-mother-was-depressed-needed-help-with-children-says-report-177992

Father Anurup, a Geologist, got his share of blame from the court; the observations would make the average Indian father reassess his work-life balance. The court has objected to his "prioritising work" and for enrolling in a Norwegian language course and taking driving lessons instead of spending more time at home. Sagarika was "rigid", the court said, for not insisting that the husband stay more at home and help. It found Anurup "rigid" because he did not encourage the children's grandparents to come to Norway. It even found Aishwarya, then barely six months old, a "rigid and silent child."

The Bhatacharyas have, through their months of ordeal, said that "cultural misunderstandings" caused this tale of separation. The Norwegian authorities have categorically denied that cultural differences have played a role in their decision to take the children away. Yet, the court noted as part of its case against the parents that they had an arranged marriage; commonplace in India, not largely understood in the West.

And the court takes umbrage at Anurup Bhattacharya saying that going back to India is the solution for the beleaguered family.

===> What kind of upbringing did the Norwegian guy who killed 77 people have?

And, I thought the Norwegians were one of the few people who averaged a double digit IQ.

Boy...am I wrong....

I bet the judge is twice divorced with 4 kids living in single families and also the judge paying/getting alimony for an illegit child. Now, that is norwegian culture.

by Kris Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:39 pm

tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

>>>> One of the jokes around our office, 'we don't have to go to europe anymore. europe is coming to us'

by MaxEntropy_Man Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:43 pm

Kris wrote:tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

>>>> One of the jokes around our office, 'we don't have to go to europe anymore. europe is coming to us'

i want to question your assumptions. there are some things i don't like about europe, but i'd like to know why YOU don't think norway, sweden etc. are better off than the US?

have you seen this article?

by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:47 pm

Kris wrote:tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

>>>> One of the jokes around our office, 'we don't have to go to europe anymore. europe is coming to us'

only the southern neo-white europe is coming to US to join the amigos. note that Germany, france, and UK and other whities are doing fine.

P.S. BTW, in case you missed it, I have promised Maria that I would verbally abuse you within 15 days - bcz no one seems to have abused you. So, you have been warned.

by Kris Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:21 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
Kris wrote:tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

>>>> One of the jokes around our office, 'we don't have to go to europe anymore. europe is coming to us'

i want to question your assumptions. there are some things i don't like about europe, but i'd like to know why YOU don't think norway, sweden etc. are better off than the US?

have you seen this article?

>>> I started reading the article but did not go thru the whole thing yet.

With regard to your question, I will start with the most obvious:

1)The US has an immensely bigger population than any of the european countries we are talking about and much more diverse than the nordic models. We will leave aside the fact that even within this model there are different levels of economic mix and match in each country. The much smaller size and the homogeneity allows each country a significantly higher level of buy-in from the populace on the trade-off between government involvement and security. So, culturally this will not translate'

2) The much touted success of the nordics- and admittedly, this is not without grounds- includes a couple of components when you look closely. This model itself shifted to the right if you will, about 15 -20 years ago, in response to address their economic problems. Secondly, North Sea oil has been a boon for Norway. This sort of income stream can cover a lot of public sector outlays, especially when your population is a scant few millions.

3) A welfare state which provides a high degree of security (and also taxes heavily to pay for it) does little to move people out of their comfort zone. This is partly because there is no need to and partly because there is no incentive to.

The above is not to argue this country has no problems. Obviously, the meltdown of 2008 is a case in point, which came about because of a financial sector gone awry, with practically no oversight. The solution to that however should not be the killing of the goose that laid the golden egg i.e. the system that engenders the ethos of risk-taking.

by Kris Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:26 am

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
Kris wrote:tch tch! dont piss on norway, sweden etc. they're the pinnacle of what lefties imagine a country should be run like.

>>>> One of the jokes around our office, 'we don't have to go to europe anymore. europe is coming to us'

only the southern neo-white europe is coming to US to join the amigos. note that Germany, france, and UK and other whities are doing fine.

P.S. BTW, in case you missed it, I have promised Maria that I would verbally abuse you within 15 days - bcz no one seems to have abused you. So, you have been warned.

>>>>The reference is to economic models, not to people. The guys making the jokes are themselves only a couple of generations removed from europe.

P.S >>> I thought I beat you in the verbal attack category. I guess I have to try harder. Smile

by Hellsangel Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:42 am

Kris wrote:
1)The US has an immensely bigger population than any of the european countries we are talking about and much more diverse than the nordic models. We will leave aside the fact that even within this model there are different levels of economic mix and match in each country. The much smaller size and the homogeneity allows each country a significantly higher level of buy-in from the populace on the trade-off between government involvement and security. So, culturally this will not translate'

Fully agree on that. That is a reason why a national healthcare plan will fail here especially when it tries to apply a one size fits all option for all states.

by Maria S Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:52 am

I have read a few articles related to this story. If there is nothing more to this, how unfortunate and what a nightmare for this family.

Saami,

Enna Swami ithu? No promises..You don't have to prove a thing to me:)!There's no voyeuristic pleasure (for me) watching anyone being harassed- in the name of whatever it may be!

Please don't bother Kris..he is among the very few Sulekha emigrants..who is easy going, does not badger anyone..and is quite witty at times! Let him be.

Now you- You mean well..I know! As the old song goes "If you don't know me by now...you will never, never know me Very Happy

!

by Guest Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:37 am

I did some of the crimes that the mother in the news story committed while bringing up my own sons. If i had lived in Norway, my sons would've prolly ended up in foster care too. Yeah, I've not been a perfect mom, but my sons turned out to be fine. My sheer good luck! Smile

Anyway, foster care is not the answer. A little extra help to the mom (the govt could as well spend on a baby sitter than pay for the foster care) and a treatement for the mom's depression would've taken care of things. Can't believe the lil ones were separated from their parents for 10 months!

by chameli Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:58 am

how did the norwegian authorities come to know of this "so called abuse " who reported it ?

and what about the Norwegian culture ?

having sex on the streets is Ok with them .it's reportedly a very liberal society ..divorce rates are going through the roof .thats OK ?

this poor Indian family has to suffer such humiliation .and why did the court take umbrage at the couple's wanting to shift back to India ?

they should be allowed to do so absolutely

by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Feb 21, 2012 3:37 pm

Kris wrote:

3) A welfare state which provides a high degree of security (and also taxes heavily to pay for it) does little to move people out of their comfort zone. This is partly because there is no need to and partly because there is no incentive to.

it is true that there is little economic mobility in many european countries and probably it has to do with the lack of incentives for risktaking. and you are right about the nordic countries -- that they are small and not necessarily good comparisons. but you have a behemoth of an economy in germany which i certainly do not regard as a welfare state. they have managed to do very well (better than the US in some respects) through this recession. and they are a people with a high level of technical accomplishment and as a whole have done very well. AND they have universal healthcare. so i don't blindly accept this republican truism that universal healthcare equals a welfare state equals zero economic mobility. germany has shown that there is a way to get this right (bailing greece out is a different matter and we can discuss that separately). but it doesn't play well in peoria because the republicans have successfully brainwashed the public.

there is one other important point the article makes that i think is worth spending some time thinking about. healthcare expenditures add to bottomline GDP numbers, but that's not necessarily a good thing. spending huge amounts of money on healthcare for morbidly obese people is neither the sign of a healthy economy nor a healthy society. so also the money americans spend on their gas guzzling cars. it's going to show up in the GDP numbers, but driving gas guzzlers and generating power using creaking, centuries old electric power plants is not a sign of anything good. just a thought.

by Kris Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:13 am

Germany is a success story and all the more so when viewed in the context of having to swallow East Germany whole. It has also stayed mostly clear of shell games conjured up by Bankers. Merkel in fact made a point recently about the anglo- american fascination with financial bubbles and went on to say essentially 'don't stray too far from basics like manufacturing'. The difference between the systems though is the history. Germans have been acculturated in a strong government/ subsidy paradigm. They have nipped and tucked as need be. To wit, there was some pullback some time ago (don't know if this happened under Merkel) on disability benefits and measures were put in place to encourage people to get off the dole. The US on the other hand comes from a place of skepticism of government or its ability to do good. I personally have mixed feelings about this. I think the animus/vitriol is unwarranted, but having seen sections of the government at work definitely think the absence of a profit motive translates to high degrees of inefficiency.

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