egypt - us in difficult position

by truthbetold Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:56 pm

According to Usa the good guys pulled off the coup because Muslim brotherhood is rapidly moving to islamist practice
Of one vote to autocracy. El baradei could be the pm.
But army pulled down a democratically elected president and is bringing back Mubarak time administrators. Can you support that kind of change?
Such is the nature of change.
If you were advising John Kerry, which side would you support and why?
It is a risk but i would support change if us govt can get assurance of timely elections in a more democratic constitution. At some point a wing of Muslim brotherhood could be brought back into regular politics.
transition to democracy is full of missteps. Egypt still has some chance to get on the right track.

by Kris Sun Jul 07, 2013 5:55 pm

truthbetold wrote:According to Usa the good guys pulled off the coup because Muslim brotherhood is rapidly moving to islamist practice
Of one vote to autocracy. El baradei could be the pm.
But army pulled down a democratically elected president and is bringing back Mubarak time administrators. Can you support that kind of change?
Such is the nature of change.
If you were advising John Kerry, which side would you support and why?
It is a risk but i would support change if us govt can get assurance of timely elections in a more democratic constitution. At some point a wing of Muslim brotherhood could be brought back into regular politics.
transition to democracy is full of missteps. Egypt still has some chance to get on the right track.

>>>I would advise him to quit dreaming that the world can be re-made in the image of the US and pursue policies and support governments that are beneficial to the West and leave it at that. Cynical as this is, the middle east cannot keep religion out of government and that religion (Islam) is one that is antithetical to democratic and secular ideals. The other choice is military rule. It is a lose-lose situation overall.

by Hellsangel Sun Jul 07, 2013 6:25 pm

Kris wrote:

>>>I would advise him to quit dreaming that the world can be re-made in the image of the US and pursue policies and support governments that are beneficial to the West and leave it at that. Cynical as this is, the middle east cannot keep religion out of government and that religion (Islam) is one that is antithetical to democratic and secular ideals. The other choice is military rule. It is a lose-lose situation overall.

Shush! The bicoastal Liberals still have the audacity of hope.
https://such.forumotion.com/t14211-desert-flower-reblooming-in-mid-summer#109561

by Kris Sun Jul 07, 2013 6:38 pm

Hellsangel wrote:
Kris wrote:

>>>I would advise him to quit dreaming that the world can be re-made in the image of the US and pursue policies and support governments that are beneficial to the West and leave it at that. Cynical as this is, the middle east cannot keep religion out of government and that religion (Islam) is one that is antithetical to democratic and secular ideals. The other choice is military rule. It is a lose-lose situation overall.

Shush! The bicoastal Liberals still have the audacity of hope.
https://such.forumotion.com/t14211-desert-flower-reblooming-in-mid-summer#109561

>>> hahaha.. I guess it is a case of hope springing eternal in the human bosom.. Smile

, except with the middle east, it is a case of repeating the same experiment hoping for a different result

by truthbetold Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:23 pm

After 500 years of stagnation Islamic societies are stirring again. It may take one or more decades but Muslim world will change dramatically by 2050. Most of us won't be around. So I can be very emphatic in my future projection.

by Kris Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:38 pm

truthbetold wrote:After 500 years of stagnation Islamic societies are stirring again. It may take one or more decades but Muslim world will change dramatically by 2050. Most of us won't be around. So I can be very emphatic in my future projection.

>>>>TBT, Won't happen on its own. There needs to be a catalyst that effects a sea change in the worldview. As of now, I am not optimistic with regard to the middle east, since any attempt at questioning any aspect of the religion is usually met with violence and suppression. In other words, there is no room allowed for the scientific/rational thought process that triggered the West's breakaway from religious dominance. It was not easy in the late middle ages, but there was forward movement in fits and starts initially, but eventually it gathered momentum. For all the breast- beating we do here about India and its superstitions, Indian culture does accommodate change and is capable of introspection at least in some quarters. We need to be thankful for that and for the fact that the idea of democracy has taken firm root in India.

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