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what is snow's ling?

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Post by Guest Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:34 pm

XH been annoying the heck out of me by saying 'snow (or barf) gir raha hai'. I keep correcting him coz i think it should be 'gir rahi hai'.

He is like, 'barish hoti hai, but snowstorm is macho'. Rolling Eyes

what is it?

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:37 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:XH been annoying the heck out of me by saying 'snow (or barf) gir raha hai'. I keep correcting him coz i think it should be 'gir rahi hai'.

He is like, 'barish hoti hai, but snowstorm is macho'. Rolling Eyes

what is it?

Now you see why Tamilans find Hindi so confusing? If snowstorm is macho, ice storms are sissies?

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Post by confuzzled dude Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:59 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:XH been annoying the heck out of me by saying 'snow (or barf) gir raha hai'. I keep correcting him coz i think it should be 'gir rahi hai'.

He is like, 'barish hoti hai, but snowstorm is macho'. Rolling Eyes

what is it?
 
Is that how they say it in Marathi? :)There is no such confusion in Telugu, definitely feminine gender.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:06 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:XH been annoying the heck out of me by saying 'snow (or barf) gir raha hai'. I keep correcting him coz i think it should be 'gir rahi hai'.

He is like, 'barish hoti hai, but snowstorm is macho'. Rolling Eyes

what is it?
 
Is that how they say it in Marathi? :)There is no such confusion in Telugu, definitely feminine gender.

No idea. Usually there is no conflict in Hindi Marathi. He makes mistakes in some other sentences. Like he would translate from Marathi to Hindi and go, 'mujhe garmi ho rahi hai'. And I would go, 'garmi LAGTI hai, hoti nahi hai. Hona is a different meaning altogether.' 20 years he hasn't changed. Also he says, 'thandi baj rahi hai' as another direct translation. I sorta kinda gave up when I saw entire clan saying the same.

Other times he challenges me on my Hindi all the time. He scored better in school than me and knowing Marathi, his Sanskrit was better too. I never got more than 28/50 in my entire Hindi career. I did better in Sanskrit as it was graded like math.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:16 am

Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:21 am

Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

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Post by confuzzled dude Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:24 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.
 
Damn! Tracy. I wouldn't dare to speak in Hindi from now on.

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Post by indophile Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:33 am

This reminds me of that thread on translating the the Hindi sign thread. The sign said - 

Hindi Sikhiye, dES ka gaurav baDhAyiye

Should it not be - Hindi Sikhiye, dES ki gareema baDhAyiye since the dES is female (bhaarat maata)?

Our friends have twins, a boy and a girl. The boy's name is Gaurav, and the girl's name is Gareema. That's how I came to know that Gareema is the female form of Gaurav.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:35 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Got one part of it. So it takes the gender of the object, not the subject. I was always confused abt that part. Clear now. But then, the big question is how do i know what the gender of each thing is? For ex: how do i know that halwa is masculine and gajar is feminine? Someone told me that once I start using the language more, i'll get it automatically. Is that how it is or is there any rule of the thumb to know what takes a masculine and what takes a feminine gender?

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:37 am

indophile wrote:This reminds me of that thread on translating the the Hindi sign thread. The sign said - 

Hindi Sikhiye, dES ka gaurav baDhAyiye

Should it not be - Hindi Sikhiye, dES ki gareema baDhAyiye since the dES is female (bhaarat maata)?

Our friends have twins, a boy and a girl. The boy's name is Gaurav, and the girl's name is Gareema. That's how I came to know that Gareema is the female form of Gaurav.

No. It's desh ki garima and desh ka gaurav. Read what I explained above. Btw desh is masculine. Mera desh mahan.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:38 am

Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Got one part of it. So it takes the gender of the object, not the subject. I was always confused abt that part. Clear now.  But then, the big question is how do i know what the gender of each thing is? For ex: how do i know that halwa is masculine and gajar is feminine? Someone told me that once I start using the language more, i'll get it automatically. Is that how it is or is there any rule of the thumb to know what takes a masculine and what takes a feminine gender?

Yes. You learn as you go.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:40 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Got one part of it. So it takes the gender of the object, not the subject. I was always confused abt that part. Clear now.  But then, the big question is how do i know what the gender of each thing is? For ex: how do i know that halwa is masculine and gajar is feminine? Someone told me that once I start using the language more, i'll get it automatically. Is that how it is or is there any rule of the thumb to know what takes a masculine and what takes a feminine gender?

Yes. You learn as you go.

Sigh! ok.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:46 am

Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Got one part of it. So it takes the gender of the object, not the subject. I was always confused abt that part. Clear now.  But then, the big question is how do i know what the gender of each thing is? For ex: how do i know that halwa is masculine and gajar is feminine? Someone told me that once I start using the language more, i'll get it automatically. Is that how it is or is there any rule of the thumb to know what takes a masculine and what takes a feminine gender?

Yes. You learn as you go.

Sigh! ok.

I googled a little bit. Sometimes you can make out by the tone in which it is spoken. But if you are reading you can't guess the tone. Most thing ending in ee sound are feminine. aa sound would be masculine and so on.

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Post by indophile Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:53 am

Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:58 am

indophile wrote:Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

I don't think so. I have seen personal errors but rarely as a group. Dahi will be khatta. Lassi will be meethi Smile The only groups of people I have seen mixing it up are bongs, South Indians and afghanis (in movies).

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 11:18 am

Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

oh wait...what i said was 'suji ki halwa' not gajar.

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Post by Merlot Daruwala Mon Dec 16, 2013 11:18 am

Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Yes. You learn as you go.

Sigh! ok.

Hey Kinny, don't waste your time. Feel free to mangle those genders. It's anyway a language of cowbelt hicks, good for only communicating with the help / taxi-drivers when you go visiting points north, and little else.

PS: Nice to see you back with the original handle. Didn't like any of the new handles you experimented with.
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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 11:19 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:

I googled a little bit. Sometimes you can make out by the tone in which it is spoken. But if you are reading you can't guess the tone. Most thing ending in ee sound are feminine. aa sound would be masculine and so on.

will keep that in mind.

It's still a challenge though.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 11:22 am

Merlot Daruwala wrote:
Kinnera wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Yes. You learn as you go.

Sigh! ok.

Hey Kinny, don't waste your time. Feel free to mangle those genders. It's anyway a language of cowbelt hicks, good for only communicating with the help / taxi-drivers when you go visiting points north, and little else.

PS: Nice to see you back with the original handle. Didn't like any of the new handles you experimented with.

ya, md. i guess i shouldn't stress over it Smile.

Thanks Smile. yeah, i tried new handles, but it didn't feel like me. I guess i am used to this handle and am comfortable only in this one.

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Mon Dec 16, 2013 12:15 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Kinnara ka pant, kinnara ka Shoes, Kinnara ka hat ?

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 12:27 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Kinnara ka pant, kinnara ka Shoes, Kinnara ka hat ?
no. as tw mentions upthread, the word describing possessiveness (ki/ka) applies to the object, not subject. a better example to help understand would be:

kinnera ki beti
kinnera ka beta

pant and shoes are both feminine in hindi. so one would use ki.

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Post by Marathadi-Saamiyaar Mon Dec 16, 2013 12:48 pm

Brigadier HK (Retd) wrote:
Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.

Kinnara ka pant, kinnara ka Shoes, Kinnara ka hat ?
no. as tw mentions upthread, the word describing possessiveness (ki/ka) applies to the object, not subject. a better example to help understand would be:

kinnera ki beti
kinnera ka beta

pant and shoes are both feminine in hindi. so one would use ki.

I realize that... Hindi is similar to German or Spanish with this masculine/feminine thingie...

My point is who "decides" if the pant is a masculine or a feminine gender? And it is outrageous to say pants and shoes are feminine....This calls for a fast unto death - Anna style - to set things right in this female-controlled world.

In spanish, there is a world council that decides annually on new words.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 12:48 pm

hoojie ji. they all playing wid us simple foolish naarthies now.

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:07 pm

Marathadi-Saamiyaar wrote:
My point is who "decides" if the pant is a masculine or a feminine gender?
there is no rule or protocol for this. it is purely by tradition. a lot of words are new like net or google or coffee. again, as tw says, you go by the sound of the word. google and net, i presume, would be masculine. coffee, again, would be feminine.

so a boy studies with his friend in his house and 'cos of the late hours has to do a sleepover. the friend's mom says, "son, you can sleep in bittu's room." the boy says, "no aunty it is OK; i'll sleep here on the couch." next morning, he is woken up by his friend's sister with tea and biscuits. says the boy, "who are you?" the girl says, "i am bittu. who are you?" the boy says, "i'm stupid."

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:21 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:hoojie ji. they all playing wid us simple foolish naarthies now.
LOL!

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Post by Seva Lamberdar Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:32 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:XH been annoying the heck out of me by saying 'snow (or barf) gir raha hai'. I keep correcting him coz i think it should be 'gir rahi hai'.

He is like, 'barish hoti hai, but snowstorm is macho'. Rolling Eyes

what is it?

According to the roots of snow as 'barf' in Hindi, both snow and snow-storm are feminine because 'barf' (the root for snow) is considered in the sense of feminine in Hindi.
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Post by indophile Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:54 pm

Is "burf" snow in Hindi? I thought burf means ice, and snow is tushaar - yaa kundendu tushaara haara dhavalaa ....

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Post by Seva Lamberdar Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:59 pm

indophile wrote:Is "burf" snow in Hindi? I thought burf means ice, and snow is tushaar - yaa kundendu tushaara haara dhavalaa ....

Colloquially, in Hindi ‘burf’ (or  ‘barf’) is used for both ice and snow, and both words (ice and snow) are used in the feminine sense.
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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:05 pm

well, storm (toofan) is masculine. so I guess that's where XH is getting mixed up. he means storm but says snow, and keeps the rest of the sentence same, coz in hindi it's tough to say 'barf ka toofan'.

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Post by Seva Lamberdar Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:22 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:well, storm (toofan) is masculine. so I guess that's where XH is getting mixed up. he means storm but says snow, and keeps the rest of the sentence same, coz in hindi it's tough to say 'barf ka toofan'.

Interesting point ... . 'barf ka toofan' is masculine, whereas snow-storm is feminine.

in 'barf ka toofan', 'barf' (feminine) is followed by 'toofan' (masuline). Thus, in the sentence, using 'toofan' after 'barf' separated by 'ka', the sense of gender is that of 'toofan' rather 'barf'.

In the case of snow-storm, it's basically one word and the nature of its gender (feminine) is based on that of snow (the essence of snow-storm).
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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:39 pm

indophile wrote:Is "burf" snow in Hindi? I thought burf means ice, and snow is tushaar - yaa kundendu tushaara haara dhavalaa ....
dhut teri ki. as MD said upthread, hindi is a mongrel language (well he did not say that but i assume he meant it) useful only in cowbelt. so if you are are among cows, hicks, belts and more cows, do not rely on sanskrit to understand hindi. rely vunly on BABAJI KA THULLU.  HTH.

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Post by nevada Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:56 pm

confuzzled dude wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Kinnera wrote:Recently I said, 'Gaajar ki halwa'. My gujji friend burst into laughing and corrected me that it's 'Gaajar ka halwa'. ok, how do you decide whether the thing is a girl or a boy? We don't have that problem in the south. all the things are an 'it'.

You add the ling to whatever you are describing. In case it is halwa and halwa is masculine even though gajar is feminine.

Like i would say kinnera ki chappal and kinnera ka joota. Kinnera ki bindi, Kinnera ka teeka. Kinnera ka baal, Kinnera ki choti. Kinnera ki choodi, Kinnera ka jhumka.
 
Damn! Tracy. I wouldn't dare to speak in Hindi from now on.

Join forces with KV, ban Hindi and save yourself some trouble!

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Post by Guest Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:00 pm

Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

I don't think so. I have seen personal errors but rarely as a group. Dahi will be khatta. Lassi will be meethi :)The only groups of people I have seen mixing it up are bongs, South Indians and afghanis (in movies).

someone else told me on chat that dahi is feminine. so ya, i am now thoroughly confused. i don't even know now if that's what i grew up saying or if i got mixed up by XH's family.

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Post by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:37 am

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:well, storm (toofan) is masculine. so I guess that's where XH is getting mixed up. he means storm but says snow, and keeps the rest of the sentence same, coz in hindi it's tough to say 'barf ka toofan'.

Interesting point ... . 'barf ka toofan' is masculine, whereas snow-storm is feminine.

in 'barf ka toofan', 'barf' (feminine) is followed by 'toofan' (masuline). Thus, in the sentence, using 'toofan' after 'barf' separated by 'ka', the sense of gender is that of 'toofan' rather 'barf'.

In the case of snow-storm, it's basically one word and the nature of its gender (feminine) is based on that of snow (the essence of snow-storm).

barf is snow? hahaha. so if a guy threw up on the snow on his way home because he had too much to drink, he'd have barfed on the barf. and is such vomit, barf ka barf or barf ki barf? maybe it's barf pe barf or barf mein barf? which is it?
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Post by indophile Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:41 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

I don't think so. I have seen personal errors but rarely as a group. Dahi will be khatta. Lassi will be meethi :)The only groups of people I have seen mixing it up are bongs, South Indians and afghanis (in movies).

someone else told me on chat that dahi is feminine. so ya, i am now thoroughly confused. i don't even know now if that's what i grew up saying or if i got mixed up by XH's family.

I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow). 

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Post by indophile Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:50 am

Seva Lamberdar wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:well, storm (toofan) is masculine. so I guess that's where XH is getting mixed up. he means storm but says snow, and keeps the rest of the sentence same, coz in hindi it's tough to say 'barf ka toofan'.

Interesting point ... . 'barf ka toofan' is masculine, whereas snow-storm is feminine.

in 'barf ka toofan', 'barf' (feminine) is followed by 'toofan' (masuline). Thus, in the sentence, using 'toofan' after 'barf' separated by 'ka', the sense of gender is that of 'toofan' rather 'barf'.

In the case of snow-storm, it's basically one word and the nature of its gender (feminine) is based on that of snow (the essence of snow-storm).

A few decades ago Amercans used to give exclusively female names to all their hurricanes (toofans). Then the womens' movement came along and protested that its unfair, and since then, hurricanes are being given male/female names alternately.

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Post by Guest Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:54 am

indophile wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

I don't think so. I have seen personal errors but rarely as a group. Dahi will be khatta. Lassi will be meethi :)The only groups of people I have seen mixing it up are bongs, South Indians and afghanis (in movies).

someone else told me on chat that dahi is feminine. so ya, i am now thoroughly confused. i don't even know now if that's what i grew up saying or if i got mixed up by XH's family.
I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow). 

ok, that explains my calling it khatta. all grandparents from delhi/agra and around.


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Post by confuzzled dude Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:14 am

Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:
I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow). 

ok, that explains my calling it khatta. all grandparents from delhi/agra and around.


Thank goodness they didn't make Hindi National language, imagine all the chaos that would've caused by this regional gender confusion, especially Southies & Bongs would be living in an eternally confused state.

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Post by peace_lover Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:23 am

confuzzled dude wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:
I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow). 

ok, that explains my calling it khatta. all grandparents from delhi/agra and around.


Thank goodness they didn't make Hindi National language, imagine all the chaos that would've caused by this regional gender confusion, especially Southies & Bongs would be living in an eternally confused state.

Urdu would have been a great choice along with its sister Dakhni in South.

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Post by MaxEntropy_Man Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:30 am

indophile wrote:
I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow).

smattering.
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Post by indophile Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:37 am

Sanskrit too has gender "problems." There is humorous verse on this. It's on the grammarian Panini's classification of "manas" (heart, the kind you love with) as a neutral gender noun.

napumsakamiti jnaatvaa
priyaayai preshitham manah /
tattu tatraiva ramate
hataah paaninaa vayam //


Meaning -  according to Panini, “manas” (heart, the kind you lose in love) is of neutral gender. Thinking that it will do no mischief, I sent it to my dear wife. Now it is simply staying put there without returning but enjoying itself. Alas! I am lost.

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Post by indophile Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:39 am

Sanskrit too has gender "problems." There is humorous verse on this. It's on the grammarian Panini's classification of "manas" (heart, the kind you love with) as a neutral gender noun.

napumsakamiti jnaatvaa
priyaayai preshitham manah /
tattu tatraiva ramate
hataah paaninaa vayam //


Meaning -  according to Panini, “manas” (heart, the kind you lose in love) is of neutral gender. Thinking that it will do no mischief, I sent it to my dear wife. Now it is simply staying put there without returning but enjoying itself. Alas! I am lost.

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Post by Guest Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:18 pm

Sanskrit is a Dravidian language. EOD.

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Post by b_A Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:10 pm

indophile wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
Tracy Whitney wrote:
indophile wrote:Are there regional differences too? dahi kattha hai vs. dahi katthi hai?

I don't think so. I have seen personal errors but rarely as a group. Dahi will be khatta. Lassi will be meethi :)The only groups of people I have seen mixing it up are bongs, South Indians and afghanis (in movies).

someone else told me on chat that dahi is feminine. so ya, i am now thoroughly confused. i don't even know now if that's what i grew up saying or if i got mixed up by XH's family.

I used to commute with a Punjabi guy on the same train to work (he has since retired). We used to discuss Urdu, Hindi, Bengali, genders, typical ways of addressing people etc. (he had his schooling in Urdu in Lahore, his wife in Hindi in Amritsar; it seems back in those days boys learnt Urdu and girls learnt Hindi). He spoke Punjabi, Urdu, Hindi, Bengali (a Kharagpur IIT alumnus) fluently, and a spattering of Telugu too (he worked in Vizag for a couple of years in his career). He is the one who told me about dahi being khatta/khatti depending on the region (it seems it's khatti in Punjab (an adoptation of Punjabi) and khatta is Delhi/Lucknow). 

Indo ,
Why is that everything is feminine in telugu except people ? We say "snow పడుతోంది / పడింది". Is it similar in sanskrit?


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Post by indophile Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:59 am

b_A wrote:
Why is that everything is feminine in telugu except people ? We say "snow పడుతోంది / పడింది".  Is it similar in sanskrit?

Yes, in Telugu everything is neutral with feminine terminations, except people. Not just verbs, some qualifiers too. For example "iddaru pillalu itu vastunnaaru vs. rendu pillulu itu vastunnaayi. Interestingly the exception to the rule is god/goddess, and demigods (hanumantudu rakshasulani tannedu, devatalu manchi chestaaru).  Sanskrit is different - first it has 3 genders and their their declensions (methods of termination) are different. Add to this an additional vachanam (single, dual, and plural), 7 vibhakties, ten tenses (Telugu like many other Indian languages has only 3 - present, past, and future), 3 persons (first, second, third) that the verbs can be expressed in (of course, the particular tense called "lET" is used only in Vedas). Thus for nouns and verbs in combination, possibilities for word terminations are many - 3 x 7 x 10 x 3 = 630. Add to this some avyayas (those that don't ever change, i.e., those with constant terminations) such as atah (for this reason). cha (and), tatah (afterwards), vRthaa (useless), etc. Thus, it's a very different language.     

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