Hindutva Chaddis resort to violence during Beef Festival in Tamil Nadu

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/RSS-BJP-protest-against-beef-fest-turns-violent-in-Tirur/articleshow/49274427.cms?

it's in kerala.

i have a question -- are these members of SFI somewhat retarded? why would they organize a 'beef festival' (whatever that means) at a university whose name is sri shankaracharya university of sanskrit?

from your posts here i get the sense that you are a vegetarian. i am too for the most part, and i am trying to turn back to completely vegetarian food as a matter of principle. i certainly don't condone violence in the name of religion, but at the same time i am unwilling to get behind idiotic causes just because it will bolster my credentials as a supporter of secularism.  i wonder why you choose to get behind moronic activities like 'beef festivals'.

what next? a pork festival at jamia millia islamia university?

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:it's in kerala.

i have a question -- are these members of SFI somewhat retarded? why would they organize a 'beef festival' (whatever that means) at a university whose name is sri shankaracharya university of sanskrit?

i am not aware of Adi Shankara's attitude towards beef consumption, but in Vedic times the cow was slaughtered for various religious rituals and beef used to be eaten by Hindus including brahmins:

In the asvamedha, the most important of public sacrifices, first mentioned in the Rgveda and discussed in the Brahmanas, more than 600 animals (including wild ones like boars) and birds were killed and its finale was marked by the sacrifice of 21 cows, which, according to the dominant opinion were sterile ones.[17] In the gosava, an important component of the public sacrifices like the rajasuya and vajapeya, a sterile spotted cow was offered to Maruts and seventeen ‘dwarf heifers under three’ were done to death in the pancasaradiyasava.[18] The killing of animals including the cattle figures in several other yajnas including caturmasya, sautramani and independent animal sacrifice called pasubandha or nirudhapasubandha...

The Vedic gods, for whom the various sacrifices were performed, had no fixed menu of food. Milk, butter, barley, oxen, goats and sheep were offered to them and these were their usual food, though some of them seem to have had their special preferences. Indra had a special liking for bulls (RV, V.29.7ab; VI.17.11b; VIII.12.8ab X.27.2c; X. 28. 3c;X.86.14ab). Agni was not a tippler like Indra, but was fond of animal food including the flesh of horses, bulls and cows (RV, VIII. 43.11; X. 91.14ab). The toothless Pusan, the guardian of the roads, ate mush as a Hobson’s choice.  Soma was the name of a heady drink but, equally importantly, of a god and killing of animals including cattle for him (RV, X.91.14ab) was basic to most of the Rgvedic yajnas. The Maruts and the Asvins were also offered cows. The Vedas mention about 250 animals out of which at least 50 were deemed fit for sacrifice and by implication for divine as well as human consumption. The animal food occupied a place of importance in the Vedic sacrifices and dietetics and the general preference for the flesh of the cow is undeniable. The Taittiriya Brahmana (III.9.8 ) categorically tells us: “Verily the cow is food” (atho annam vai gauh) and the Satapatha Brahmana (III.1.2.21) refers to Yajnavalkya’s stubborn insistence on eating the tender (amsala) flesh of the cow.

http://www.indowindow.com/sad/article.php?child=17&article=11

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With respect to the last sentence in the above, the Yajnavalkya being referred to is the most famous of all Upanishadic philosophers and he categorically says in the Shatapatha Brahmana that he eats beef.

historical justification is irrelevant (i knew that was coming next). the vast majority of contemporary hindus consider beef eating to be proscribed by their religion. on such matters their opinion matters more than  yagyavalkya's.

do you eat beef? if not, why not?

Rashmun wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/RSS-BJP-protest-against-beef-fest-turns-violent-in-Tirur/articleshow/49274427.cms?

Nice provocation. Idiots will posts links here and idiots will respond to this stupidity on ground as well.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:historical justification is irrelevant (i knew that was coming next). the vast majority of contemporary hindus consider beef eating to be proscribed by their religion. on such matters their opinion matters more than  yagyavalkya's.

do you eat beef? if not, why not?

it is true that i do not eat beef because i have some kind of mental block against eating it due to the way i was brought up. Having said that if there is nothing else to eat other than beef i will eat it--i will not starve. I must have eaten beef 2-3 times in my life. Once when i was at the home of my uncle (in Canada) for dinner and my cousins had cooked pasta and they had added beef in the pasta sauce. I ate it knowing that the pasta sauce contained beef because there was nothing else to eat (other than i suppose bread and butter). Both the children of my uncle are married to caucasians and my cousins eat beef although my uncle and his wife do not.

On one occasion i ate beef not knowing that it was beef. And i think i ate beef on one other occasion; i don't recall whether i ate it knowingly or not this time.

With respect to your earlier question about meat eating i tend to avoid meat although i occasionally eat chicken and fish. I avoid red meat completely though.

your parents and uncle and aunt are fairly representative of the majority of contemporary hindus with regards to beef eating. they certainly don't seem to be paying much heed to yagyavalkya's opinion.

personal consumption of dog meat is legal in 44 american states (although it's illegal in all states to sell it), but the idea revolts most people. i am sure there are some who enjoy eating dog meat (rice with a side of medium rare rover), but i don't see them organizing 'dog meat festivals' anytime soon. when it comes to such matters, logic dictates that you respect local opinion.

that said, i concur that the law and order machinery should protect retarded people too.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:your parents and uncle and aunt are fairly representative of the majority of contemporary hindus with regards to beef eating. they certainly don't seem to be paying much heed to yagyavalkya's opinion.

personal consumption of dog meat is legal in 44 american states (although it's illegal in all states to sell it), but the idea revolts most people. i am sure there are some who enjoy eating dog meat (rice with a side of medium rare rover), but i don't see them organizing 'dog meat festivals' anytime soon. when it comes to such matters, logic dictates that you respect local opinion.

that said, i concur that the law and order machinery should protect retarded people too.

My understanding is that many if not most Hindus in Kerala eat beef. Ditto for Hindus in North-East India, and Hindus in Goa. Dalits all over India eat beef to the best of my knowledge. Also, with respect to your claim that retarded people should be given police protection, do take a look at this article: http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report-activist-rahul-easwar-attacked-for-not-supporting-beef-festival-in-kerala-alleges-left-wing-fascism-2132732

http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/deepa-nisanth-interview-didnt-expect-happy-my-comments-churned-out-debate-34989

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:it's in kerala.

i have a question -- are these members of SFI somewhat retarded? why would they organize a 'beef festival' (whatever that means) at a university whose name is sri shankaracharya university of sanskrit?

from your posts here i get the sense that you are a vegetarian. i am too for the most part, and i am trying to turn back to completely vegetarian food as a matter of principle. i certainly don't condone violence in the name of religion, but at the same time i am unwilling to get behind idiotic causes just because it will bolster my credentials as a supporter of secularism.  i wonder why you choose to get behind moronic activities like 'beef festivals'.

what next? a pork festival at jamia millia islamia university?

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/muslim-professor-offers-to-take-people-out-for-pork-lunch-wants-to-spread-the-message-of-religious-tolerance/1/493905.html

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:it's in kerala.

i have a question -- are these members of SFI somewhat retarded? why would they organize a 'beef festival' (whatever that means) at a university whose name is sri shankaracharya university of sanskrit?

from your posts here i get the sense that you are a vegetarian. i am too for the most part, and i am trying to turn back to completely vegetarian food as a matter of principle. i certainly don't condone violence in the name of religion, but at the same time i am unwilling to get behind idiotic causes just because it will bolster my credentials as a supporter of secularism.  i wonder why you choose to get behind moronic activities like 'beef festivals'.

what next? a pork festival at jamia millia islamia university?

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/muslim-professor-offers-to-take-people-out-for-pork-lunch-wants-to-spread-the-message-of-religious-tolerance/1/493905.html

irrelevant!

I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

i would not personally participate in such a function as a beef festival; the reason for this is that i do not eat beef. but if someone organizes such a function then deep down i would feel happy because a beef festival would contribute as a kind of strong protest against killing people for eating beef. as long as people are killed for eating beef i see nothing wrong in people organizing beef festivals as a kind of protest.

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it was definitely supported by one assistant professor in the university (deepa nisanth), but the university did not officially support the beef festival to the best of my knowledge.

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it's an odd way of registering protest. the university granting permission doesn't change my opinion, because to me there are other ethical issues that are at odds with supporting this method of protesting.

Rashmun wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it was definitely supported by one assistant professor in the university (deepa nisanth), but the university did not officially support the beef festival to the best of my knowledge.

from your link above:

The union announced the programme two days ago and the university authorities had granted permission for organizing the festival. But, the union members said that, a group of BJP and RSS workers in the locality allegedly staged protest on campus and interrupted the programme, when it started in morning,.

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

i would not personally participate in such a function as a beef festival; the reason for this is that i do not eat beef. but if someone organizes such a function then  deep down i would feel happy because a beef festival would contribute as a kind of strong protest against killing people for eating beef. as long as people are killed for eating beef i see nothing wrong in people organizing beef festivals as a kind of protest.

is your reason for not eating beef simply that you are unfamiliar with the taste and find it unpleasant? as someone raised as a brahmin and/or perhaps as a result of your own personal value system arrived at by knowing yourself better, do you not have ethical questions about killing animals for food? i am trying to better understand your position.

bw wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it was definitely supported by one assistant professor in the university (deepa nisanth), but the university did not officially support the beef festival to the best of my knowledge.

from your link above:

The union announced the programme two days ago and the university authorities had granted permission for organizing the festival. But, the union members said that, a group of BJP and RSS workers in the locality allegedly staged protest on campus and interrupted the programme, when it started in morning,.

i stand corrected.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it's an odd way of registering protest. the university granting permission doesn't change my opinion, because to me there are other ethical issues that are at odds with supporting this method of protesting.

i can see that this will provoke the RSS crowd into violence and offend the sensibilities of many devout hindus, possibly leading to more chaos.

is that what you are referring to by 'ethical issues'?

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it's an odd way of registering protest. the university granting permission doesn't change my opinion, because to me there are other ethical issues that are at odds with supporting this method of protesting.

i can see that this will provoke the RSS crowd into violence and offend the sensibilities of many devout hindus, possibly leading to more chaos.

is that what you are referring to by 'ethical issues'?

that's an undesirable outcome, but the wanton (perhaps unintentional) promoting of the meat industry, the treatment of animals and the damage to the environment is also problematic to me at a personal level.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

i would not personally participate in such a function as a beef festival; the reason for this is that i do not eat beef. but if someone organizes such a function then  deep down i would feel happy because a beef festival would contribute as a kind of strong protest against killing people for eating beef. as long as people are killed for eating beef i see nothing wrong in people organizing beef festivals as a kind of protest.

is your reason for not eating beef simply that you are unfamiliar with the taste and find it unpleasant? as someone raised as a brahmin and/or perhaps as a result of your own personal value system arrived at by knowing yourself better, do you not have ethical questions about killing animals for food? i am trying to better understand your position.

let us discuss the ethical question of killing animals for food in a separate thread. i'll start such a thread soon. bw please share your views on the new thread on this issue.

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

i would not personally participate in such a function as a beef festival; the reason for this is that i do not eat beef. but if someone organizes such a function then  deep down i would feel happy because a beef festival would contribute as a kind of strong protest against killing people for eating beef. as long as people are killed for eating beef i see nothing wrong in people organizing beef festivals as a kind of protest.

is your reason for not eating beef simply that you are unfamiliar with the taste and find it unpleasant? as someone raised as a brahmin and/or perhaps as a result of your own personal value system arrived at by knowing yourself better, do you not have ethical questions about killing animals for food? i am trying to better understand your position.

let us discuss the ethical question of killing animals for food in a separate thread. i'll start such a thread soon. bw please share your views on the new thread on this issue.

unfortunately it's not a separate issue in this case. it is inextricably linked to these questions and is foundational to my disagreements with you and with others who support this protest.

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it's an odd way of registering protest. the university granting permission doesn't change my opinion, because to me there are other ethical issues that are at odds with supporting this method of protesting.

i can see that this will provoke the RSS crowd into violence and offend the sensibilities of many devout hindus, possibly leading to more chaos.

is that what you are referring to by 'ethical issues'?

>>>I am not familiar with the facts here, since beef-eating as a political issue both ways seems to be contrived to whip up emotions. The beef festival promoters are just adding fuel to this fire.

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

bw wrote:

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:

Rashmun wrote:I would like to know the view of Swapna on this issue.

i still don't know what your opinion is. do you approve of this so called 'beef festival'? we already know you disapprove of the violence that ensued. what is your opinion of the festival itself?

wasn't this done as a protest against the lynching of the guy and supported by the university?

it's an odd way of registering protest. the university granting permission doesn't change my opinion, because to me there are other ethical issues that are at odds with supporting this method of protesting.

What's odd about it? When an oppressive power uses violence to arbitrarily prohibit an activity, it is absolutely correct to protest against such oppression by openly indulging in that very activity. That's exactly what Gandhi did with his Dandi march.

If you don't support it, that's fine. But there's nothing wrong with the form of protest.

1. The slaughter of cows and consumption of beef is legal in Kerala.*

2. The dishes containing beef were prepared legally after securing permission from the University authorities.

3. That group of BJP and RSS workers who entered the premises illegally and threw away the dishes should have been arrested and thrown in jail.

Except in Goa where Uniform Civil Code prevails, India has Sharia for muslims and Common Law for all non-muslims. Unless the Indian constitution is amended to abolish Sharia, such problems will continue.

*The laws on what animals are illegal for slaughter, and the penalties thereof, vary from state to state.
http://indianexpress.com/article/explained/explained-no-beef-nation/

After Sree Kerala Varma College in Thrissur, it was Maharaja’s College’s turn to throw its hat into the ring.

Protesting against the lynching of a man at Dadri accusing him of eating beef and the suspension of Sree Kerala Varma College students for organising a beef festival on their campus, Kerala Students Union (KSU) activists at Maharaja’s College on Tuesday organised a beef festival on the campus.

The event was based on a simple concept — to feed beef to as many members of the student community as possible.

The event, which took off at the Central Circle inside the campus, was inaugurated by Tambi Subramanyam, State secretary of the Youth Congress.

This was followed by distribution of cooked beef along with bread loaves to all those present on the campus.

“In a democracy, eating whatever one wants to is a personal choice. The intolerance towards an individual’s food habits is against the spirit of national unity and secularism, and the act of banning beef is a mode of discrimination against the already marginalised communities,” said Kishore K.V., a third year B.Sc Physics student, who played a key role in organising the festival.

The event received overwhelming response with several students taking part. The one-hour-long event passed off peacefully in the absence of any voice of dissent.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Kochi/after-kerala-varma-college-maharajas-organises-beef-festival/article7732848.ece?ref=relatedNews

The word beef is no longer just a dietary usage. It has entered the religio-political lexicon in a toxic form evoking violence, anger, grief and fear with polarising effect. In Kerala, in the last week, Beef Fests in college campuses organised largely by the Students Federation of India (CPM student wing) activists have become a form of resistance to the dietary control that is being imposed in some of the north Indian states.
In protest to the mob lynching of Mohammed Akhlaq in Dadri, UP, on rumours of beef being consumed by him, student unions of SFI and Kerala Students Union (Congress) organised beef festivals in colleges in almost all the districts in Kerala. And this was not without incident. 14 students belonging to the SFI have been suspended in different parts of Kerala: six students of Sree Kerala Varma College, Thrissur and eight students from CMS College, Kottayam.

The tussle between Akhil Bharatiya Vidyarthi Parishad (BJP) and SFI took a violent turn on October 1 when the SFI kick-started their current beef festival in the state (there have been earlier ones) in Sree Kerala Varma College, Thrissur, which comes under the aegis of the Cochin Devaswom Board. SFI brought in bread and beef and was offering it to students in front of the union office. ABVP activists objected and there was a scuffle. An ABVP member is reportedly said to have got hurt in the fight.

The SFI Thrissur district secretary Senthil Kumar K S says, "Sree Kerala Varma college is a vibrant campus where issues are discussed. We oppose the agenda of the RSS and BJP to control our food habits so we decided to have a beef festival. We did not coerce anyone to eat the food. It was by large a peaceful event till a group of ABVP students tried to disrupt the festival. We then retaliated. There was no major incident or injury or it would have been a police case. Six students were suspended because they brought beef into the campus and conducted a beef festival. Though the canteen is vegetarian students do bring non vegetarian food and also non-veg is served during farewell and other functions."

While B Gopalakrishnan, BJP state cell coordinator, says, "The ABVP students objected because Sree Kerala Varma College managed by the Cochin Devaswom Board has a rule that only vegetarian food is allowed on the campus. Both in the canteen and the women's hostel serve only vegetarian food. Nobody can check what students bring in their tiffin boxes but for all functions only vegetarian food is served. The college was started because a Hindu boy was denied admission by St Thomas College, Thrissur. So they went to the Kochi Raja and he gave 25 acres of land to start a college for Hindus. And the Raja laid down two conditions and one was to serve vegetarian food only and the other was to light a lamp at the shrine. We are not against beef fests but there is a rule that you cannot serve beef in the college so we opposed that."

Says George Pulikuthiyil, director of Janeneethi, Thrissur, "A Hindu student being denied admission on his caste and religion into St Thomas College, Thrissur has not been heard about before. There is a possibility that a child did not get admission because he did not have the requisite marks. St Thomas College has children from all communities and Kerala chief ministers like EMS Namboodiripad to C Achutha Menon studied in the college and for that matter there are many teachers from the Hindu community there too. The kings of Kerala were benevolent to all communities. And the same king had given land to the Christian community to build churches. Sree Kerala Varma College which is a government aided college is not only for Hindus. This is a divisive talk by the BJP who seek to polarise the community in order to gain politically. They desperately want a few seats in Kerala."

M Vijin, SFI state secretary says that they will not allow college campuses to be divided on religion and castes. "Indian college campuses have not been divided  on these lines before and we will not allow this in Kerala." An assistant professor of Sree Kerala Varma College Deepa Nisanth who shared a post on the Facebook page came in for criticism. Her post which she deleted said something to this effect: Today they say no to beef equating colleges to temples, tomorrow they will ban entry of menstruating women and even the backward classes, stating the same reason." She told the media that she had only shared a post and she had deleted the same after there was a protest. The BJP now wants her to be dismissed from the college for supporting the beef fest but that seems unlikely to happen because of the wide support from the students and political support from the likes of Home Minister Ramesh Chennithala and CPM leader Pinarayi Vijayan.

Interestingly ABVP at a press conference soon after the incident said they were not against beef fests. It seems like a politically astute move because with Kerala gearing up for local body elections and anti-beef rhetoric may alienate voters. So at the moment the Kerala BJP unit is taking the Goa example and let beef be on the Kerala cuisine. "We are not discussing a ban on beef at the moment." Says Gopalakrsihnan.

http://www.outlookindia.com/article/eating-beef-in-resistance/295558