The language of South Asia: Hindustani (Hindi)

Hindi is a mark of respectability in Afghanistan, where Sanskrtised
Khadiboli differentiates a speaker from meddlesome neighbours from
across the eastern border. In Bangladesh and Bhutan, Hindi competes with
neither Bengali nor Dzongkha. If at all, the prevalence of Hindi proves
the point of politicians in these countries, that Nepali in Thimphu and
Urdu in Dhaka are somehow alien languages. In Pakistan, a Hindi-speaker
is simply complemented for his good command over Urdu. Even in Sri
Lanka, Tamils and Sinhalese alike have less dislike for Hindi than they
have for each other’s language.......

In addition to entertainment and politics, Hindi is being backed by a
vast market. English-language newspapers make a big splash, and
‘ethno-national’ language telecasts are coveted by aspiring politicians
everywhere. But all the while, it is the space between the two forces of
globalisation and localisation that is expanding faster than both.
Hindi newspapers are getting bigger and better, and taking increasingly
larger shares of print advertising. Hindi television channels are riding
on the popularity of soap operas that vie with each other for eyeballs,
rather than with English- or regional-language programmes. But more
than anything else, Hindi is now also accepted as the language of the
elite, to which the rest can aspire without fear of being labelled
behenji, bhaiya or desi....

The credit for establishing Hindi in the corridors of power should go to
the (dollar) millionaires that have made their fortunes in the
post-1990 free market of Southasia. When new entrepreneurs in Colombo,
Calcutta, Karachi, Kashmir, Kathmandu, Manipal, Mumbai and Manipur
assemble, they easily lapse into Hindostani after ritual introductions
have been made in formal English. Hindi is now a language of business;
and when money talks, everybody listens. No wonder, leaders that
function as facilitators between business and politics such as the
Samajwadi Party’s Amar Singh, the Congress’s Jairam Ramesh or the
Communist Party of India (Marxist)’s Sitaram Yechury often speak chaste
Hindi.

Culturally, victims of Dravidian politics in Tamil Nadu have done more
to establish Hindi than perhaps they themselves realise. When
opportunities for employment shrank at home due to large-scale
reservations for ‘backward’ classes, the so-called Tam-Brams made a
beeline for foreign shores. There they were confronted with Bongs,
Gujjus, Pajis and Mallus exchanging cassettes of Kishor Kumar’s songs
with Sindhis and Marwaris. Ever since, there has been no stopping the
popularity of Hindi, and now they exchange Ranvir Kapoor-Deepika
Padukone DVDs. The symbolism of H D Deve Gowda reading Hindi speeches
written for him in Kannada script, or Sonia Gandhi struggling with the
text of Roman Hindi, is powerful, but the medium receives more media
attention when Lalu Yadav uses it to woo Silicon Valley stalwarts or
Harvard graduates at PIO and NRI jamborees....

In ‘Bollywood Hindi’ – a hybrid Hindostani purveyed by one of the
biggest film industries in the world as the authentic lingua franca of
the hoi polloi – the word hungama is used to signify a mixture of
agitation, excitement and commotion. Something similar happened in the
erstwhile Kingdom of Nepal, when its newly elected vice-president of the
republic, Parmanand Jha, chose to sign his official pledge in Nepali
but to recite the oath of office in Hindi.

Soon after the official ceremonies were over, hyper-nationalists began
to burn tyres in the streets of Kathmandu, competing with each other in
deriding the judgement of the second most exalted position in the
republic. Farther down the chain, mere nationalists were happy that the
vice-president’s deviance from the norm had not gone unchallenged, while
semi-nationalists opined pompously that everyone should have shown
restraint – the implication being that the VP was merely reaping what he
had sown. Meanwhile, soft nationalists were willing to offer the
offender a chance to apologise, on the condition that he should promise
not to repeat the mistake in future. Poor Vice-President Jha was
vilified in the media as irrational, irresponsible and anti-national.
Even executive members of the Nepal Bar Association decided to decry the
legality of what was clearly a political action.

Criticism of Nepal’s new vice-president from activists committed to the
advancement of local languages was somewhat understandable. Jha’s
ambivalence towards his own mother tongue, Maithili, was justifiably
deplored by members of his own community. But promoters of Nepali were
being unnecessarily parochial and paranoid. After all, the promotion of
Hindi would probably benefit Nepali more than any other language of
Nepal’s plains. The situation is similar to every other country of
Southasia, where propagation of Hindi justifies expansionist policies of
state-sponsored ‘national’ languages.

Any local, regional or global solidarity needs a language that ties
them together into a garland. No matter how hard they try, the French
and the German cannot resist the recognition of English as the main link
language of the European Union. American hegemony has similarly
established English as the official language of ASEAN. The shared
colonial past likewise made the pioneers of SAARC accept English as the
organisation’s language of operation. Perhaps now is the time to
introduce Hindostani as the alternate official language of the SAARC.
Doing so should help to allay the fear of street patriots in Nepal, and
make every Southasian feel that the Mumbai Masala churned out by the
Bollywood Dream Machine is at least partly their own.

http://www.himalmag.com/component/content/article/873-hindostani-country.html

be careful not to criticize charvaka till he gives you his permission. you've done good till now.

Huzefa Kapasi wrote:be careful not to criticize charvaka till he gives you his permission. you've done good till now.

i am really scared now.

LOL.

Rashmun wrote:The shared
colonial past likewise made the pioneers of SAARC accept English as the
organisation’s language of operation. Perhaps now is the time to
introduce Hindostani as the alternate official language of the SAARC.
Doing so should help to allay the fear of street patriots in Nepal, and
make every Southasian feel that the Mumbai Masala churned out by the
Bollywood Dream Machine is at least partly their own.

Man, the delusions of some Hindians! If India tries to get anything called Hindustani adopted as the official language of the SAARC, that would confirm the fears smaller countries have about Indian hegemony, not allay them.

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:The shared
colonial past likewise made the pioneers of SAARC accept English as the
organisation’s language of operation. Perhaps now is the time to
introduce Hindostani as the alternate official language of the SAARC.
Doing so should help to allay the fear of street patriots in Nepal, and
make every Southasian feel that the Mumbai Masala churned out by the
Bollywood Dream Machine is at least partly their own.

Man, the delusions of some Hindians! If India tries to get anything called Hindustani adopted as the official language of the SAARC, that would confirm the fears smaller countries have about Indian hegemony, not allay them.

Yo Telangan, the writer of this article is not a Hindian. He is a Nepali.

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:The shared
colonial past likewise made the pioneers of SAARC accept English as the
organisation’s language of operation. Perhaps now is the time to
introduce Hindostani as the alternate official language of the SAARC.
Doing so should help to allay the fear of street patriots in Nepal, and
make every Southasian feel that the Mumbai Masala churned out by the
Bollywood Dream Machine is at least partly their own.

Man, the delusions of some Hindians! If India tries to get anything called Hindustani adopted as the official language of the SAARC, that would confirm the fears smaller countries have about Indian hegemony, not allay them.

Yo Telangan, the writer of this article is not a Hindian. He is a Nepali.

Looks like I upset you with the use of the term Hindian.

What do you think is Lalji's native language?

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:The shared
colonial past likewise made the pioneers of SAARC accept English as the
organisation’s language of operation. Perhaps now is the time to
introduce Hindostani as the alternate official language of the SAARC.
Doing so should help to allay the fear of street patriots in Nepal, and
make every Southasian feel that the Mumbai Masala churned out by the
Bollywood Dream Machine is at least partly their own.

Man, the delusions of some Hindians! If India tries to get anything called Hindustani adopted as the official language of the SAARC, that would confirm the fears smaller countries have about Indian hegemony, not allay them.

Yo Telangan, the writer of this article is not a Hindian. He is a Nepali.

Looks like I upset you with the use of the term Hindian.

What do you think is Lalji's native language?

--> it could be nepali. it could be hindi. it could be maithili. we do not know.

--> Lal gives the example of the Nepali Vice President Jha taking his oath in hindi--but Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun wrote:Lal gives the example of the Nepali Vice President Jha taking his oath in hindi--but Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Hahaha. I like it how you sometimes argue that Maithili is a dialect of Hindi (when you want to count Maithili speakers to say "lots of people speak Hindi"), and sometimes consider it a different language.

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:Lal gives the example of the Nepali Vice President Jha taking his oath in hindi--but Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Hahaha. I like it how you sometimes argue that Maithili is a dialect of Hindi (when you want to count Maithili speakers to say "lots of people speak Hindi"), and sometimes consider it a different language.

--> of course it is a dialect of hindi. but the point is that Jha did not take his oath in this hindi dialect--Maithili-- but in hindi.

--> looks like you have decided to shut up about Lal and will now keep on talking about Jha.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

charvaka wrote:Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

--> it is well recognized that the meaning of a word depends upon the context of the statement in which that word occurs. but since C logic consists of ignoring context in statements of people one disagrees with it is natural that you seek to find flaws where none exist.

--> your refusal to comment any more on Lal is noted.

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

--> it is well recognized that the meaning of a word depends upon the context of the statement in which that word occurs.

I see, it all depends on the meaning of word not!

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

--> it is well recognized that the meaning of a word depends upon the context of the statement in which that word occurs.

I see, it all depends on the meaning of word not!

C logic: Just ignore the context of the occurrence of the word and then keep posting LOL's.

Rashmun Method: When caught lying, keep up the lying.

charvaka wrote:Rashmun Method: When caught lying, keep up the lying.

Charvako Method: When caught making up shit, call the person who catches you a liar.

One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

a dialect of a language is also, after all, a language. for instance, bhojpuri is a language but bhojpuri is also a dialect of hindi. is this really so hard to comprehend?

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

a dialect of a language is also, after all, a language. for instance, bhojpuri is a language but bhojpuri is also a dialect of hindi. is this really so hard to comprehend?

So Maithili is (a dialect of) Hindi. It is also not Hindi. Advaitam, anyone?

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

Munni badnam hui, Hindi tere liye. Jhooti saali.

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

a dialect of a language is also, after all, a language. for instance, bhojpuri is a language but bhojpuri is also a dialect of hindi. is this really so hard to comprehend?

So Maithili is (a dialect of) Hindi. It is also not Hindi. Advaitam, anyone?

--> Correct. This may help:

The term dialect (from the Greek Language word dialektos, Διάλεκτος) is used in two distinct ways, even by linguists. One usage refers to a variety of a language that is a characteristic of a particular group of the language's speakers.^[1]
The term is applied most often to regional speech patterns, but a
dialect may also be defined by other factors, such as social class.^[2] A dialect that is associated with a particular social class can be termed a sociolect;
a regional dialect may be termed a regiolect or topolect. The other
usage refers to a language socially subordinate to a regional or
national standard language, often historically cognate to the standard, but not a variety of it or in any other sense derived from it^{[citation needed]}. This more precise usage enables distinguishing between varieties of a language, such as the French spoken in Nice, France, and local languages distinct from the superordinate language, e.g. Nissart, the traditional native Romance language of Nice, known in French as Niçard.

A dialect is distinguished by its vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation (phonology, including prosody). Where a distinction can be made only in terms of pronunciation, the term accent is appropriate, not dialect. Other speech varieties include: standard languages, which are standardized for public performance (for example, a written standard); jargons, which are characterized by differences in lexicon (vocabulary); slang; patois; pidgins or argots.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

a dialect of a language is also, after all, a language. for instance, bhojpuri is a language but bhojpuri is also a dialect of hindi. is this really so hard to comprehend?

So Maithili is (a dialect of) Hindi. It is also not Hindi. Advaitam, anyone?

--> Correct. This may help:

The term dialect (from the Greek Language word dialektos, Διάλεκτος) is used in two distinct ways, even by linguists. One usage refers to a variety of a language that is a characteristic of a particular group of the language's speakers.^[1]
The term is applied most often to regional speech patterns, but a
dialect may also be defined by other factors, such as social class.^[2] A dialect that is associated with a particular social class can be termed a sociolect;
a regional dialect may be termed a regiolect or topolect. The other
usage refers to a language socially subordinate to a regional or
national standard language, often historically cognate to the standard, but not a variety of it or in any other sense derived from it^{[citation needed]}. This more precise usage enables distinguishing between varieties of a language, such as the French spoken in Nice, France, and local languages distinct from the superordinate language, e.g. Nissart, the traditional native Romance language of Nice, known in French as Niçard.

A dialect is distinguished by its vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation (phonology, including prosody). Where a distinction can be made only in terms of pronunciation, the term accent is appropriate, not dialect. Other speech varieties include: standard languages, which are standardized for public performance (for example, a written standard); jargons, which are characterized by differences in lexicon (vocabulary); slang; patois; pidgins or argots.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect

This definition of dialect does not support what you originally said (that someone's mother tongue is NOT Hindi, but Maithili.) According to this definition, you can either say "Jha's mother tongue is Maithili, a dialect of Hindi" or "Jha's mother tongue is Hindi".

What do you actually did, instead, was disingenuous at best. After it has been pointed out to you, your lack of a recantation smacks of deliberate lying as usual.

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

a dialect of a language is also, after all, a language. for instance, bhojpuri is a language but bhojpuri is also a dialect of hindi. is this really so hard to comprehend?

So Maithili is (a dialect of) Hindi. It is also not Hindi. Advaitam, anyone?

--> Correct. This may help:

The term dialect (from the Greek Language word dialektos, Διάλεκτος) is used in two distinct ways, even by linguists. One usage refers to a variety of a language that is a characteristic of a particular group of the language's speakers.^[1]
The term is applied most often to regional speech patterns, but a
dialect may also be defined by other factors, such as social class.^[2] A dialect that is associated with a particular social class can be termed a sociolect;
a regional dialect may be termed a regiolect or topolect. The other
usage refers to a language socially subordinate to a regional or
national standard language, often historically cognate to the standard, but not a variety of it or in any other sense derived from it^{[citation needed]}. This more precise usage enables distinguishing between varieties of a language, such as the French spoken in Nice, France, and local languages distinct from the superordinate language, e.g. Nissart, the traditional native Romance language of Nice, known in French as Niçard.

A dialect is distinguished by its vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation (phonology, including prosody). Where a distinction can be made only in terms of pronunciation, the term accent is appropriate, not dialect. Other speech varieties include: standard languages, which are standardized for public performance (for example, a written standard); jargons, which are characterized by differences in lexicon (vocabulary); slang; patois; pidgins or argots.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect

This definition of dialect does not support what you originally said (that someone's mother tongue is NOT Hindi, but Maithili.) According to this definition, you can either say "Jha's mother tongue is Maithili, a dialect of Hindi" or "Jha's mother tongue is Hindi".

What do you actually did, instead, was disingenuous at best. After it has been pointed out to you, your lack of a recantation smacks of deliberate lying as usual.

did you notice that two definitions of 'dialect' have been given? Why do you insist on making an ass of yourself again and again?

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:This definition of dialect does not support what you originally said (that someone's mother tongue is NOT Hindi, but Maithili.) According to this definition, you can either say "Jha's mother tongue is Maithili, a dialect of Hindi" or "Jha's mother tongue is Hindi".

What do you actually did, instead, was disingenuous at best. After it has been pointed out to you, your lack of a recantation smacks of deliberate lying as usual.

did you notice that two definitions of 'dialect' have been given? Why do you insist on making an ass of yourself again and again?

Yes I also notice that neither definition supports your usage.

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:This definition of dialect does not support what you originally said (that someone's mother tongue is NOT Hindi, but Maithili.) According to this definition, you can either say "Jha's mother tongue is Maithili, a dialect of Hindi" or "Jha's mother tongue is Hindi".

What do you actually did, instead, was disingenuous at best. After it has been pointed out to you, your lack of a recantation smacks of deliberate lying as usual.

did you notice that two definitions of 'dialect' have been given? Why do you insist on making an ass of yourself again and again?

Yes I also notice that neither definition supports your usage.

Wrong.

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:

Rashmun wrote:

charvaka wrote:This definition of dialect does not support what you originally said (that someone's mother tongue is NOT Hindi, but Maithili.) According to this definition, you can either say "Jha's mother tongue is Maithili, a dialect of Hindi" or "Jha's mother tongue is Hindi".

What do you actually did, instead, was disingenuous at best. After it has been pointed out to you, your lack of a recantation smacks of deliberate lying as usual.

did you notice that two definitions of 'dialect' have been given? Why do you insist on making an ass of yourself again and again?

Yes I also notice that neither definition supports your usage.

Wrong.

Right!

Ram Sharan wrote:

charvaka wrote:One poster, two opposite claims, one thread. Priceless.

Rashmun: Jha's native language was not hindi, but maithili.

Rashmun: of course it is a dialect of hindi.

I am done with this thread.

Munni badnam hui, Hindi tere liye. Jhooti saali.

Dude, whoever you are, it is better for you to express your opinions in your normal handle. Otherwise, you only make it seem like you have to hide behind a "fake" handle just to snipe at your stalkee. Have the courage to speak your mind in your regular handle.