Re: Telangana Telugu an offshoot of Dakhni?

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:22 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:3. Telugu grammarians had deep reverence for the sanskrit language and for sanskrit grammar and took all of their grammar rules, with minor modifications, from sanskrit grammar.
Telugu grammar has fundamental differences from Sanskrit grammar. You just need to read what has already been posted, before repeating lies.

in an earlier post in this thread you wrote:
charvaka wrote:He says "Telugu grammars" follow Sanskrit grammar. By that he means that textbooks on Telugu grammar follow Sanskrit grammar.

--> do you agree that textbooks on telugu grammar follow sanskrit grammar? it is sad to see you tying yourself up in knots again. there is nothing special if one well known Telugu poet violated the rules of Telugu grammar. There are many english and hindi poets who have also violated the rules of grammar in their poetry. there is also nothing special if spoken telugu is different from written telugu. the same is true for hindi also.
I have already posted a detailed account of the fundamental differences between Telugu and Sanskrit grammar. You lack the knowledge to dispute even one single point I have listed. That is entirely your problem, not mine.

--> The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar but at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:23 am

Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Panini is normally dated to around the 6th century BCE.

--> Panini is dated to circa 4th century BC (and not 6th century BC as you wrongly say).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahabharata

--> Many Sanskrit texts were re-written in accordance with classical Sanskrit during the time of the Guptas.
Ah, good old Wikipedia. By the same source, Panini is dated to:

Pāṇini (c. 600-500 BCE), ancient Sanskrit grammarian

PS: I know monkeys at keyboards tend to get lost when printed material on the internet concerns multiple subjects. I am referring to the first result on the page.

Looks like wikipedia managed to confuse your monkey brain again:
Pāṇini (Sanskrit: पाणिनि, IPA: [pɑːɳin̪i]; a patronymic meaning "descendant of Paṇi") was an ancient Indian Sanskrit grammarian from Pushkalavati, Gandhara (fl. 4th century BC[1][2]).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pāṇini

----

From about the 4th century BC, in the classical period of Iron Age Ancient India, Vedic Sanskrit gave way to Classical Sanskrit as defined by the grammar of Pāṇini.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vedic_Sanskrit

From about the 6th century BC, in the classical period of Iron Age Ancient India, Vedic Sanskrit gave way to Classical Sanskrit as defined by the grammar of Pāṇini.

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:26 am

Rashmun wrote:The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar

He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

Rashmun wrote:at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.

He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:26 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Panini is normally dated to around the 6th century BCE.

--> Panini is dated to circa 4th century BC (and not 6th century BC as you wrongly say).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahabharata

--> Many Sanskrit texts were re-written in accordance with classical Sanskrit during the time of the Guptas.
Ah, good old Wikipedia. By the same source, Panini is dated to:

Pāṇini (c. 600-500 BCE), ancient Sanskrit grammarian

PS: I know monkeys at keyboards tend to get lost when printed material on the internet concerns multiple subjects. I am referring to the first result on the page.

Looks like wikipedia managed to confuse your monkey brain again:
Pāṇini (Sanskrit: पाणिनि, IPA: [pɑːɳin̪i]; a patronymic meaning "descendant of Paṇi") was an ancient Indian Sanskrit grammarian from Pushkalavati, Gandhara (fl. 4th century BC[1][2]).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pāṇini

----

Pāṇini (Sanskrit: पाणिनि, IPA: [pɑːɳin̪i]; a patronymic meaning "descendant of Paṇi") was an ancient Indian Sanskrit grammarian from Pushkalavati, Gandhara (fl. 6th century BC^[1]^[2]).

Born

An Indian stamp honoring Pāṇini
est. 6th century BC

Panini was born in Shalatula, a town near to Attock on the Indus river in present day Pakistan. The dates given for Panini are pure guesses.Experts give dates in the 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th century BC and there is also no agreement among historians about the extent of the work which he undertook. What is in little doubt is that, given the period in which he worked, he is one of the most innovative people in the whole development of knowledge. We will say a little more below about how historians have gone about trying to pinpoint the date when Panini lived.

http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/history/Biographies/Panini.html

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:28 am

Rashmun wrote:Panini was born in Shalatula, a town near to Attock on the Indus river in present day Pakistan. The dates given for Panini are pure guesses.Experts give dates in the 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th century BC and there is also no agreement among historians about the extent of the work which he undertook. What is in little doubt is that, given the period in which he worked, he is one of the most innovative people in the whole development of knowledge. We will say a little more below about how historians have gone about trying to pinpoint the date when Panini lived.

http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/history/Biographies/Panini.html

Good. Now, how did you glean that the Ramayana and Mahabharata were rewritten to Panini's rules? What happened to the older versions? Did they use an HP shredder to shred those versions? Or did the VHP organize a book-burning festival? Eager minds want to know.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:30 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar
He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

i don't think you read his full thesis.

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.
He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:31 am

Rashmun, you have demonstrated a complete ignorance of the topics you are arguing about. I am out of patience. You lack the knowledge to dispute any of the five major differences I have highlighted between Telugu and Sanskrit grammar. Why don't you google and learn enough Sanskrit grammar and Telugu grammar before we continue this debate. In the meanwhile, argue with yourself.

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:32 am

Rashmun wrote:i don't think you read his full thesis.

I did. I already pointed out how you misinterpreted it.

Rashmun wrote:the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

Bullshit.

See this.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:34 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:Panini was born in Shalatula, a town near to Attock on the Indus river in present day Pakistan. The dates given for Panini are pure guesses.Experts give dates in the 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th century BC and there is also no agreement among historians about the extent of the work which he undertook. What is in little doubt is that, given the period in which he worked, he is one of the most innovative people in the whole development of knowledge. We will say a little more below about how historians have gone about trying to pinpoint the date when Panini lived.

http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/history/Biographies/Panini.html
Good. Now, how did you glean that the Ramayana and Mahabharata were rewritten to Panini's rules? What happened to the older versions? Did they use an HP shredder to shred those versions? Or did the VHP organize a book-burning festival? Eager minds want to know.

refer to the first volume of 'History of Indian Philosophy' by Erich Frauwallner and while you are at it you may as well remove the HP shredder which has accidentally gotten lodged in your brain.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:37 am

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.
Bullshit.

Sad to see you mouthing inanities after failing to read the PhD thesis, whose link i gave, properly.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:39 am

charvaka wrote:Rashmun, you have demonstrated a complete ignorance of the topics you are arguing about. I am out of patience. You lack the knowledge to dispute any of the five major differences I have highlighted between Telugu and Sanskrit grammar. Why don't you google and learn enough Sanskrit grammar and Telugu grammar before we continue this debate. In the meanwhile, argue with yourself.

The PhD scholar in fact pointed out numerous (many more than five) differences between Telugu grammar and Sanskrit grammar. Yet he insists that Telugu grammarians continued to formulate their rules based on the rules laid down in Sanskrit grammar. Also, he points out the deep reverence and respect the Telugu grammarians had for Sanskrit to the extent that all the traditional texts of Telugu grammar are in Sanskrit.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:47 am

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar
He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

i don't think you read his full thesis.

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.
He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

see for example page 15 of the PhD thesis (which Charvaka has not bothered to read so far):
http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077060/00001/30j

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:51 am

Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar
He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

i don't think you read his full thesis.

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.
He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

see for example page 15 of the PhD thesis (which Charvaka has not bothered to read so far):
http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077060/00001/30j

see also pages 17 and 18.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:53 am

Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:Max, what are your views on the synthesis of Oriya and Telugu languages which took place in North-East Andhra? Is this another example of a NI language synthesizing with a SI language?
Have you ever seen the Oriya script? It looks very different from the scripts of northindia, and very much like the scripts of Telugu, Tamil, Kannada and Malayalam, with its rounded characters. What are your views about that?

the whole world is convinced that Oriya is a Indo-Aryan language
As am I. So why do you think the script looks like that of Dravidian languages?

i cannot answer this because i have not studied the different scripts. I am more interested in the fact that a synthesis took place between an Indo-Aryan language (Oriya) and a dravidian language (Telugu) in North-East Andhra because of which many telugus are unable to understand the telugu spoken in North-East Andhra.

According to the Russian linguist M.S. Andronov, Proto-Dravidian
gave rise to 21 Dravidian Languages. They can be broadly
classified into three groups: Northern group, Central group, and
Southern group of Dravidian languages.

The Northern group consists of three languages. The central group consists
ten langauages. Out of these ten, only telugu became a civilized
language and the rest of the nine languages remained tribal languages.
The southern group consists of languages which includes Kannada, Tamil,
Malayalam, Tulu and others.

Telugu split from Proto-Dravidian between 1500-1000 BC. So, Telugu became
a distinct language by the time any literary activity began to appear in
the Tamil land.

Kannada split from Proto-Dravidian around 0 BC. Note that the current
similarity in scripts between Kannada and Telugu has a lot more
with Chalukyas rule of Andhra than the similarity between the
languages. Admittedly, Kannada is Telugu's closest cousin. In
India the history of scripts has been almost independent of
the history of languages.

http://www.teluguworld.org/Telugu/dravidian_class.html

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:55 am

Another very interesting language is Konkani. It is the official language of Goa, and is widely spoken in Coastal Karnataka, and Northern Kerala. It is an Indo-Aryan language.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:59 am

There are also examples of dravidian languages existing in North India. For instance, Kurukh. And the Pakistani language Brahui is a also a dravidian language.

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:17 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:The PhD scholar gives even more differences between sanskrit grammar and telugu grammar
He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

i don't think you read his full thesis.

charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:at the end of the day he admits that Telugu grammarians formulated their rules following the rules of sanskrit grammar. Moreover, the Telugu grammarians were writing all the grammar books of Telugu in Sanskrit.
He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

see for example page 15 of the PhD thesis (which Charvaka has not bothered to read so far):
http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077060/00001/30j

see also pages 17 and 18.

Even his/her PhD mentor wouldn't have read this thesis so thoroughly.
I am happy to see a Phd thesis that was so confusing to let two people come to entirely different conclusions. This should be in Phd Comics.

lol!

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:23 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:He does not. He focuses on just one aspect -- how samAsas are formed in Telugu and Sanskrit. I gave examples that are more wide-ranging.

i don't think you read his full thesis.

charvaka wrote:He does not. He wrote the paper to emphasize the limitations of such an influence. Hahaha.

the limitations arose, according to this PhD scholar, because of the over enthusiasm of the Telugu grammarians for sanskrit grammar to the extent that the Telugu grammarians started using sanskrit rules of grammar inappropriately to construct their own rules. one can hardly blame sanskrit for the incompetence of the telugu grammarians.

see for example page 15 of the PhD thesis (which Charvaka has not bothered to read so far):
http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077060/00001/30j

see also pages 17 and 18.

Even his/her PhD mentor wouldn't have read this thesis so thoroughly.
I am happy to see a Phd thesis that was so confusing to let two people come to entirely different conclusions. This should be in Phd Comics.

There is no confusion. The confusion is only in the brain of people who have not read the PhD thesis.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:26 pm

with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:52 pm

Rashmun wrote:with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

PS: No offense to all the armchair linguists or other serious linguists.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:55 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:57 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:04 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:07 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:with respect to Andhra Pradesh, the following synthesis of an Indo-Aryan language with Telugu has taken place:
1. synthesis of Telugu with sanskrit which gave rise to classical telugu (in which 60% words are sanskrit or of sanskrit origin)
2. synthesis of Telugu with Oriya which gave rise to the Telugu spoken in North-East Andhra which many Telugus of other parts of AP are unable to comprehend.
3. synthesis of Telugu with Dakhini which gave rise to Telangana Telugu which is also known as Hybrid Telugu or Dakhini Telugu.

---

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:09 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:

jeez louise... Telugu is a Whore.

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:12 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

doffus
An idiot.

A klutz.
Oh man - I'm such a doffus, I just cut my leg off.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=doffus

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:14 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:

Trashmun.. are you the Armchair linguist who got offended by what I said.

PS: hahahaha

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:16 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

Doffus, i am offended that you offered a filthy insult to an Indian language.

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up Telangana Telugu an offshoot of Dakhni? - Page 6 459784477

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:22 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:

Trashmunni.. you were offended. Well my job here is done then.

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:24 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

if anyone were to offer a filthy insult to Tamil i bet you would jump up and down as if someone had put red ants in your chaddis.

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

Trashmunni.. hahahaha.

## You are upset
### you are angry.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:28 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:

Really.. you know me well Trashmunni. What can I say, I am blinded by my devotion to Tamizh and I am a bigot when it comes to other languages, that I sit here and post links after links denouncing every other language.

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

Trashmunni.. hahahaha.

## You are upset
### you are angry.

Doffus, looks like the FDA not only rejected your useless drug, but imposed severe financial penalties on your employers for your fabrications which resulted in many people suffering from severe adverse reactions after consuming the useless drug you came up with.

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:37 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

Thanks for letting us know that. Now simmer down.

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

Trashmunni.. hahahaha.

## You are upset
### you are angry.

Doffus, looks like the FDA not only rejected your useless drug, but imposed severe financial penalties on your employers for your fabrications which resulted in many people suffering from severe adverse reactions after consuming the useless drug you came up with.

Trashman, Can you give us a link stating something completely opposite to what you said above and then misinterpret that link with posts after posts?

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:41 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:

Wow.. few continuous posts by you without any links. Trashmunni is all growed up

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

Trashmunni.. hahahaha.

## You are upset
### you are angry.

Doffus, looks like the FDA not only rejected your useless drug, but imposed severe financial penalties on your employers for your fabrications which resulted in many people suffering from severe adverse reactions after consuming the useless drug you came up with.

Trashman, Can you give us a link stating something completely opposite to what you said above and then misinterpret that link with posts after posts?

Doffus, is it fair to say that your employers are tightening the screws after your useless drug resulted in chaos and anarchy in the clinical trials due to most subjects suffering severe adverse reactions?

by doofus_maximus Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:53 pm

Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
doofus_maximus wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

Doffus, did the FDA reject the useless drug you came up with? Is that why you are ranting and raving here?

Trashmunni.. hahahaha.

## You are upset
### you are angry.

Doffus, looks like the FDA not only rejected your useless drug, but imposed severe financial penalties on your employers for your fabrications which resulted in many people suffering from severe adverse reactions after consuming the useless drug you came up with.

Trashman, Can you give us a link stating something completely opposite to what you said above and then misinterpret that link with posts after posts?

Doffus, is it fair to say that your employers are tightening the screws after your useless drug resulted in chaos and anarchy in the clinical trials due to most subjects suffering severe adverse reactions?

You must have found a link from Bollywhat forum stating the exact opposite. Please cut and paste it.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:43 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:Have you ever seen the Oriya script? It looks very different from the scripts of northindia, and very much like the scripts of Telugu, Tamil, Kannada and Malayalam, with its rounded characters. What are your views about that?

the whole world is convinced that Oriya is a Indo-Aryan language
As am I. So why do you think the script looks like that of Dravidian languages?

i cannot answer this because i have not studied the different scripts. I am more interested in the fact that a synthesis took place between an Indo-Aryan language (Oriya) and a dravidian language (Telugu) in North-East Andhra because of which many telugus are unable to understand the telugu spoken in North-East Andhra.

According to the Russian linguist M.S. Andronov, Proto-Dravidian
gave rise to 21 Dravidian Languages. They can be broadly
classified into three groups: Northern group, Central group, and
Southern group of Dravidian languages.

The Northern group consists of three languages. The central group consists
ten langauages. Out of these ten, only telugu became a civilized
language and the rest of the nine languages remained tribal languages.
The southern group consists of languages which includes Kannada, Tamil,
Malayalam, Tulu and others.

Telugu split from Proto-Dravidian between 1500-1000 BC. So, Telugu became
a distinct language by the time any literary activity began to appear in
the Tamil land.

Kannada split from Proto-Dravidian around 0 BC. Note that the current
similarity in scripts between Kannada and Telugu has a lot more
with Chalukyas rule of Andhra than the similarity between the
languages. Admittedly, Kannada is Telugu's closest cousin. In
India the history of scripts has been almost independent of
the history of languages.

http://www.teluguworld.org/Telugu/dravidian_class.html

---

Proto-Dravidian gave rise to totally 21 Dravidian languages. They are

Northern Group

Brahui
Malto
Kudukh

Central Group

Gondi
Konda
Kui
Manda
Parji
Gadaba
Kolami
Pengo
Naiki
Kuvi
Telugu

Southern Group

Tulu
Kannada
Kodagu
Toda
Kota
Malayalam
Tamil

https://lists.hcs.harvard.edu/mailman/listinfo/proto-dravidian

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:18 pm

Rashmun wrote:

Proto-Dravidian gave rise to totally 21 Dravidian languages. They are

Northern Group

Brahui
Malto
Kudukh

Central Group

Gondi
Konda
Kui
Manda
Parji
Gadaba
Kolami
Pengo
Naiki
Kuvi
Telugu

Southern Group

Tulu
Kannada
Kodagu
Toda
Kota
Malayalam
Tamil

https://lists.hcs.harvard.edu/mailman/listinfo/proto-dravidian

what next? are you going to discover that sanskrit gave birth to hindi?

Telangana Telugu an offshoot of Dakhni? - Page 6 Captain-obvious-captain-obvious-dumb-superhero-internet-meme-demotivational-poster-1234392340

Telangana Telugu an offshoot of Dakhni? - Page 6 Captain-obvious-captain-obvious-dumb-superhero-internet-meme-demotivational-poster-1234392340

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:37 pm

Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
Rashmun wrote:
charvaka wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

the whole world is convinced that Oriya is a Indo-Aryan language
As am I. So why do you think the script looks like that of Dravidian languages?

i cannot answer this because i have not studied the different scripts. I am more interested in the fact that a synthesis took place between an Indo-Aryan language (Oriya) and a dravidian language (Telugu) in North-East Andhra because of which many telugus are unable to understand the telugu spoken in North-East Andhra.

According to the Russian linguist M.S. Andronov, Proto-Dravidian
gave rise to 21 Dravidian Languages. They can be broadly
classified into three groups: Northern group, Central group, and
Southern group of Dravidian languages.

The Northern group consists of three languages. The central group consists
ten langauages. Out of these ten, only telugu became a civilized
language and the rest of the nine languages remained tribal languages.
The southern group consists of languages which includes Kannada, Tamil,
Malayalam, Tulu and others.

Telugu split from Proto-Dravidian between 1500-1000 BC. So, Telugu became
a distinct language by the time any literary activity began to appear in
the Tamil land.

Kannada split from Proto-Dravidian around 0 BC. Note that the current
similarity in scripts between Kannada and Telugu has a lot more
with Chalukyas rule of Andhra than the similarity between the
languages. Admittedly, Kannada is Telugu's closest cousin. In
India the history of scripts has been almost independent of
the history of languages.

http://www.teluguworld.org/Telugu/dravidian_class.html

---

Proto-Dravidian gave rise to totally 21 Dravidian languages. They are

Northern Group

Brahui
Malto
Kudukh

Central Group

Gondi
Konda
Kui
Manda
Parji
Gadaba
Kolami
Pengo
Naiki
Kuvi
Telugu

Southern Group

Tulu
Kannada
Kodagu
Toda
Kota
Malayalam
Tamil

https://lists.hcs.harvard.edu/mailman/listinfo/proto-dravidian

A few things to note:

The vast majority of Telugus are nationalists. But a tiny minority are regionalists. These regionalist Telugus go around claiming kinship with Kannadigas, Malayalis, and Tamils on the basis of the fact that their first language Telugu is a dravidian language like the first language of the Tamils, Malayalis, and Kannadigas. These people need to be told that Telugu is in the Central Group of Dravidian languages in which neither Tamil, Kannada, nor Malayalam are placed. If they must claim kinship based on language then they should first do so with people residing in north india and central india whose first language is Gondi, Konda, Kui, Manda, or some of the other languages in the Central Group of dravidian languages in which Telugu is placed.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:59 pm

Rashmun wrote:

These people need to be told that Telugu is in the Central Group of Dravidian languages in which neither Tamil, Kannada, nor Malayalam are placed. If they must claim kinship based on language then they should first do so with people residing in north india and central india whose first language is Gondi, Konda, Kui, Manda, or some of the other languages in the Central Group of dravidian languages in which Telugu is placed.

that's idiotic. it displays your absolute ignorance of the mutual history of telugus and tamils. telugus and tamils have many cultural ties that go beyond just language. madras has vast numbers of telugus who for all intents and purposes are tamils outside their homes. telugus and tamils share a deep affection for carnatic music. for millenia tamil vocalists have been singing the telugu krithis of thyagaraja and annamacharya. patnam subramania iyer, a tamilian primarily composed carnatic krithis in telugu. the best known krithis of shyama shastri, a tamilian are all in telugu. and it pleases me no end that the stigma attached to singing tamil krithis on the carnatic concert platform is now firmly a thing of the past. telugu vocalists like malladi brothers, hyderabad brothers and balamurali krishna regularly feature tamil krithis in their concerts.

edited to add: and thyagaraja lived and attained samadhi at thiruvaiyyaru in the thanjavur district in TN. he was a fluent speaker of tamil although he composed in telugu.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:08 pm

that's not all. here is another thing i discovered due to my interaction with carvaka and pseudo on sulekha. many of the folk tales and heroes of tamilians are also major characters amongst the telugu people. i didn't know for example that kattabomman who fought the first battle of independence against the brits was a venerated figure amongst the telugus. and thiNNan (aka kaNNappa nAyanAr) a figure who appears in the periya purANAm (saivite bhakti poetry) is a much loved character amongst telugus.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:20 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
Rashmun wrote:

These people need to be told that Telugu is in the Central Group of Dravidian languages in which neither Tamil, Kannada, nor Malayalam are placed. If they must claim kinship based on language then they should first do so with people residing in north india and central india whose first language is Gondi, Konda, Kui, Manda, or some of the other languages in the Central Group of dravidian languages in which Telugu is placed.

that's idiotic. it displays your absolute ignorance of the mutual history of telugus and tamils. telugus and tamils have many cultural ties that go beyond just language. madras has vast numbers of telugus who for all intents and purposes are tamils outside their homes. telugus and tamils share a deep affection for carnatic music. for millenia tamil vocalists have been singing the telugu krithis of thyagaraja and annamacharya. patnam subramania iyer, a tamilian primarily composed carnatic krithis in telugu. the best known krithis of shyama shastri, a tamilian are all in telugu. and it pleases me no end that the stigma attached to singing tamil krithis on the carnatic concert platform is now firmly a thing of the past. telugu vocalists like malladi brothers, hyderabad brothers and balamurali krishna regularly feature tamil krithis in their concerts.

Telugus also have cultural ties with north indians and central Indians. for instance, telugu grammarians formulated their rules of grammar on the basis of Panini's sanskrit grammar. Panini was from north-west India.

Then Telugus have their own translations of North Indian religious works. For instance, the Telugu translation of Tulsidas's Hanuman Chalisa. Most religious Telugus who are Hindus chant the Hanuman Chalisa regularly as part of their prayers. Religious Hindus in North India also chant Hanuman Chalisa regularly. This is only one example of the cultural bond existing between North Indians and Telugus.

As of today, two Telugus (film actress Jaya Prada and cricketer Azaharuddin) are Lok Sabha Member of parliaments elected from Uttar Pradesh.

If Tamils and Telugus had been living in complete harmony then there would have been no demand for separate statehood for Andhra.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:28 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:that's not all. here is another thing i discovered due to my interaction with carvaka and pseudo on sulekha. many of the folk tales and heroes of tamilians are also major characters amongst the telugu people. i didn't know for example that kattabomman who fought the first battle of independence against the brits was a venerated figure amongst the telugus. and thiNNan (aka kaNNappa nAyanAr) a figure who appears in the periya purANAm (saivite bhakti poetry) is a much loved character amongst telugus.

Who is more venerated by Telugus--Kattabomman or Hanuman? The fact that religious Telugus who are Hindus venerate Hanuman just as religious Hindus of North India venerate Hanuman is another example of the cultural bond between Telugus and North Indians. Another example: Muslims of AP are culturally closer to North India than to TN. The reason is that the most important sufi shrines are in North India. For instance the shrine of Moinuddin Chishti in Ajmer and of Nizamuddin Aulia in Delhi. Moreover, the first language of the vast majority of muslims in AP is Dakhini (also known as Dakhini Urdu) which is a variant of the Hindustani language. For this reason, a muslim from AP would be more comfortable communicating with someone from UP than with someone from TN.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:52 pm

Rashmun wrote: For this reason, a muslim from AP would be more comfortable communicating with someone from UP than with someone from TN.

rashmun why are you being a regionalist and dividing people? all indians are your brothers and sisters.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:20 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
Rashmun wrote: For this reason, a muslim from AP would be more comfortable communicating with someone from UP than with someone from TN.

rashmun why are you being a regionalist and dividing people? all indians are your brothers and sisters.

the fact that divisions because of languages and religions and castes exist cannot be denied. For instance, my dalit friend from Tamil Nadu told me that he felt proud when Mayawati (who is a dalit) became the Chief Minister of UP.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:37 pm

so it's only a problem if someone else other than you mentions these things. nice.

by Guest Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:45 pm

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:so it's only a problem if someone else other than you mentions these things. nice.

My ultimate goal when i mention these things is to unite, and not to divide. It bothers me when i see anyone mentioning these things with the goal of dividing, and not uniting. I have never liked any cliques based on religion or region or caste.

by charvaka Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:41 pm

doofus_maximus wrote:Even his/her PhD mentor wouldn't have read this thesis so thoroughly.
I am happy to see a Phd thesis that was so confusing to let two people come to entirely different conclusions. This should be in Phd Comics.

LOL @ PhD Comics. We are certainly producing some mild entertainment on this thread. It is interesting when confusion is the product of the mental makeup of the reader rather than that of the writer.

by MaxEntropy_Man Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:49 pm

a telugu composition by a tamilian sung by another tamilian.

by charvaka Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:39 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:that's not all. here is another thing i discovered due to my interaction with carvaka and pseudo on sulekha. many of the folk tales and heroes of tamilians are also major characters amongst the telugu people. i didn't know for example that kattabomman who fought the first battle of independence against the brits was a venerated figure amongst the telugus. and thiNNan (aka kaNNappa nAyanAr) a figure who appears in the periya purANAm (saivite bhakti poetry) is a much loved character amongst telugus.

I don't know if I have mentioned this before, but in the rAmAlayam in the small town in the heart of Telangana where some of my relatives live, Tiruppavai is sung, and a shrine to AndALamma is frequented by women. One of my aunts used to recite pallAnDu pallAnDu etc.

Many of the rulers of Tamil lands during the centuries before the British were Telugus by ethnicity. They brought with them poets and scholars from Andhra Pradesh to their courts in Thanjavur. Centuries before that, the Vengi Chalukyas who ruled the Telugu heartland were feudatories to the Cholas of Tamil Nadu. Before that, the Pallavas ruled parts of both AP and TN. The cultural ties that bind the Telugu and Tamil people are strong and deep. Telugu has exceptionally strong cultural ties with Kannada as well. Their scripts are so similar that I could begin reading Kannada within a few days of arriving in Bangalore. The Vijayanagara Empire was basically a confederacy of Telugu and Kannada rulers. The great Telugu poet Srinathudu described himself as a poet of the karnATa-bhAsha, although he wrote in Telugu.

by charvaka Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:40 am

MaxEntropy_Man wrote:
Rashmun wrote: For this reason, a muslim from AP would be more comfortable communicating with someone from UP than with someone from TN.

rashmun why are you being a regionalist and dividing people? all indians are your brothers and sisters.

Excellent question... LOL.

by MaxEntropy_Man Thu Apr 19, 2012 8:10 am

Rashmun wrote:
Who is more venerated by Telugus--Kattabomman or Hanuman? The fact that religious Telugus who are Hindus venerate Hanuman just as religious Hindus of North India venerate Hanuman is another example of the cultural bond between Telugus and North Indians.

just re-read this and burst out laughing. what kind of a crazy ass comparison is this? one is a character from religious mythology venerated by all hindus, and other was a local chieftain who is credited with waging the first war of independence against a foreign power. you are so childish.

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